Board index » delphi » Re: .NET features you'd like to see in Win32

Re: .NET features you'd like to see in Win32


2007-06-16 03:30:38 AM
delphi199
Sig schreef:
Quote
David Clegg writes:
>To that end, I would be interested to hear from other .NET developers here
>why they choose to develop in .NET.

Just from my head - WCF, WPF, ASP.NET, language independence, very rich
class library. Also MS specific things like, very stable IDE, extremely
good help system.
I'd like to add that the performance argument is mostly a non-issue with
.Net 2.0.
I can have spectacular performance in .Net 2.0 that will in many cases
beat equivalent Delphi code that uses the standard Delphi class
libraries. In my experience it will often take hand crafted Object
Pascal code to beat well written .Net 2.0 code (with emphasis on well
written). The fact that the managed .Net 2.0 XML classes (including xml
transforms) are usually just as fast as the native MSXML library says a
lot. MSXML is as fast as you will get in XML parser land.
You also don't have to worry about internationalization issues as
everything is unicode, like it or not.
The IDE may be slow and offer only limited refactorings but at least it
is stable and the refactorings that are there and the code
editor/formatter are rock solid.
And once you've tasted the use of generics trust me you won't look back.
I also have to mention the support for X509 certificates and digital
(xml) signatures etc... right out of the box. I have to use those every
day (both in Delphi win32 and in .Net code). Try to use a win32 web
service with ssl with client certificates, you can start hacking away at
HTTPRIO.pas and relatives first after you've implemented the necessary
crypto api wrappers yourself. Or just try to work with digital
signatures and smartcards.
I still like Delphi but it is becoming like an old car you don't like to
dump because it has served you so well in the past and it will still get
you from here to there, well, most of the time.
Danny
---
 
 

Re: .NET features you'd like to see in Win32

I.P. Nichols writes:
Quote
Unfortunately when someone mentions Visual Studio you start a
lamentation about what bad experiences you have had so it is pointless
to even attempt a discussion.
That is unfair, and depends on the context of the thread. I usually
trot that out to counter the incessant and repetitive CodeGear bashing
that goes on in here. Especially WRT to areas that have been
acknowledged as problems, and are being addressed.
Heres a revelation for you then. I actually prefer the Visual Studio
code editor to the Delphi one.
--
Cheers,
David Clegg
XXXX@XXXXX.COM
cc.codegear.com/Author/72299
QualityCentral. The best way to bug CodeGear about bugs.
qc.codegear.com
"Here's to {*word*63} : The cause of, and answer to all of life's
problems." - Homer Simpson
 

Re: .NET features you'd like to see in Win32

"David Clegg" writes:>I.P. Nichols writes:
Quote

>Unfortunately when someone mentions Visual Studio you start a
>lamentation about what bad experiences you have had so it is pointless
>to even attempt a discussion.

That is unfair, and depends on the context of the thread. I usually
trot that out to counter the incessant and repetitive CodeGear bashing
that goes on in here. Especially WRT to areas that have been
acknowledged as problems, and are being addressed.

Heres a revelation for you then. I actually prefer the Visual Studio
code editor to the Delphi one.
OK, so write100 times on the blackboard, "I love Visual Studio". ;-)
 

Re: .NET features you'd like to see in Win32

Farshad,
| However, in a Garbage Collected it would cause the Timer to be free
| as soon as it falls out of scope.
Which, I think, is why David's idea of the "Transient" control-word (or
something similar) is a good idea.
--
Q
06/15/2007 13:42:14
XanaNews Version 1.17.5.7 [Q's salutation mod]
 

Re: .NET features you'd like to see in Win32

Farshad,
| | .NET features you'd like to see in Win32
|
| Managed Code! :P :P :P
Then it better damn well be under switch control!!!!!!!
--
Q
06/15/2007 13:44:40
XanaNews Version 1.17.5.7 [Q's salutation mod]
 

Re: .NET features you'd like to see in Win32

Quote
Heres a revelation for you then. I actually prefer the Visual Studio
code editor to the Delphi one.
Me too, although I have been scared to say so!
Steve
 

Re: .NET features you'd like to see in Win32

I.P. Nichols writes:
Quote
OK, so write100 times on the blackboard, "I love Visual Studio". ;-)
Since you're tacitly admitting you had offered an unfair
characterization of David's comments, it would be more fitting if you
write "I still love Delphi" on your blackboard. :p
--
Brian Moelk
Brain Endeavor LLC
XXXX@XXXXX.COM
 

Re: .NET features you'd like to see in Win32

"Q Correll"
Quote
Farshad,

| However, in a Garbage Collected it would cause the Timer to be free
| as soon as it falls out of scope.

Which, I think, is why David's idea of the "Transient" control-word (or
something similar) is a good idea.
Umm. I haven't noticed that in David's post. Thanks for reminding. Actually,
it is a greate idea.
Let's call it Controlled Garbaged Collection (CGC). I liked it. :)
It also maintains backward compatibility. However, it will be annoying to
add the keyword each time you declare a new object. We can have a new
compiler directive which can turn Transient mode on and off. So by turning
the Transient mode ON all objects will be subject to GC unless you use the
keyword "Permanent". :)
procedure TForm1.Button1Click(Sender: TObject);
var
Timer : TTimer; permanent;
begin
Timer:=TTimer.Create(Self); // Timer is perpetual
Timer.OnTimer:=Timer1Timer;
Timer.Enabled:=True;
end;
 

Re: .NET features you'd like to see in Win32

danny heijl writes:
Quote
I can have spectacular performance in .Net 2.0 that will in many cases
beat equivalent Delphi code that uses the standard Delphi class
libraries.
Do you have any examples that I can download and test it myself?
Thanks,
Sarah
 

Re: .NET features you'd like to see in Win32

I.P. Nichols writes:
Quote
Laughable or not, it is true. On my machine even Delphi's IDE usual
lackluster speed isn't a problem. it is Dual CPU over clocked by 50%, a
fsb and 2GB DDR2 memory running at 830MHz, 10,000 rpm Raptor SATA II HD
and 7600GT video system will damn well overcome any speed problem that
.NET has. ;-)
I wish all my clients have that kind of machines! ;)
 

Re: .NET features you'd like to see in Win32

"Sarah"
Quote
I wish all my clients have that kind of machines! ;)
Some of my clients are still running Windows NT 4.0 on Pentium III 333 Mhz.
With native Delphi code performance is not a real issue on out-dated
hardware.
 

Re: .NET features you'd like to see in Win32

I.P. Nichols writes:
Quote
OK, so write100 times on the blackboard, "I love Visual Studio". ;-)
for i := 0 to 500 do
Console.WriteLine(i.ToString + ' Okay, agreed. Now let's get back
to the main topic of this thread! Thank you!!');
;-)
Regards,
Sarah
 

Re: .NET features you'd like to see in Win32

I.P. Nichols writes:
Quote
OK, so write100 times on the blackboard, "I love Visual Studio". ;-)
Rather than do that, lets get this conversation back on track, and you
jot down exactly what features in Visual Studio you'd love to see
implemented in Delphi. Here's a handful to get the ball rolling :-
- Auto code formatting and indenting in the code editor
- Code Completion for XML documentation comments
- Hint window style prompts for available code templates.
A good example of the latter is when assigning an event delegate. All
that is usually required is myObject.MyEvent += [Tab][Tab]. And the
thing I prefer about it over the Delphi code template implementation is
that it is easily ignored. To do that in Delphi you need to ensure all
your code templates are manually invoked, which then puts the onus on
the developer to remember when there is a code template available for a
particular coding construct.
--
Cheers,
David Clegg
XXXX@XXXXX.COM
cc.codegear.com/Author/72299
QualityCentral. The best way to bug CodeGear about bugs.
qc.codegear.com
"We can outsmart those dolphins. Don't forget -- we invented computers,
leg warmers, bendy straws, peel-and-eat shrimp, the {*word*148}, AND the
pudding cup." - Homer Simpson
 

Re: .NET features you'd like to see in Win32

I.P. Nichols writes:
Quote
OK, so write100 times on the blackboard, "I love Visual Studio". ;-)
for i := 0 to 100 do
Console.WriteLine(i.ToString + ' Okay, agreed. Now let us get back
to the main topic of this thread! Thank you!!');
;-)
Regards,
Sarah
 

Re: .NET features you'd like to see in Win32

Sarah writes:
Quote
danny heijl writes:
>I can have spectacular performance in .Net 2.0 that will in many cases
>beat equivalent Delphi code that uses the standard Delphi class
>libraries.

Do you have any examples that I can download and test it myself?

Not so difficult. Anything that uses serialization will be a lot faster
than any generic (as in RTTI-based) approach in native Delphi.
Usually even normal operations (reading, XSL, etc) are faster than MSXML.
This makes xml web services faster as well. :-)