Re: How bad is Kylix?

JQP

Delphi Developer

Re: How bad is Kylix?

2003-12-23 07:11:24 AM
delphi244
"Rhys Sage" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes

Quote

I have Mandrake 9.1 running KDE as a little plaything. Quite honestly, I
find it is very clunky and lacks the finesse of Windows (which initself
lacks
the finesse of the Mac).
I recently tried installing Mandrake on an old Win98 machine with 64 meg RAM

and a 1 gig harddrive. I eliminated every non-essential package I was
offered but still couldn't come up with enough room for a GUI; either KDE or
Gnome. All I could get was the command line.
So much for the myth that Linux is lean and efficient compared to Windows.

Mike Mormando

Delphi Developer

2003-12-23 07:12:37 AM

Re: How bad is Kylix?

"JQP" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes news:XXXX@XXXXX.COM...

Quote

Compatibility and deployment issues and lack of concern for same is
inherent
to Open Source methodology. Any natively compiled, non-Open Source
desktop
app is likely to face serious issues in the Linux world. If not now, just
wait til the next round of OS updates <g>.
Which would be now.

Kernal 2.6 was released just the other day.
Mike

Rhys Sage

Delphi Developer

2003-12-23 07:17:23 AM

Re: How bad is Kylix?

Mandrake certainly seems bloated. It took forever to install itself from 2
CDs.
SME Linux, however, which I use on my server installed from a single CD and
installed in about half an hour. that is not graphical though.
IMHO, the finest O/S one can put on an old W98 system or an old W95 system
is NT4 although I haven't tried the other flavours of Linux (Red Hat,
Debian, SuSe or Coral).
Rhys
I tried it on an old P166 and it worked but
"JQP" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes

Quote

"Rhys Sage" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
news:XXXX@XXXXX.COM...
>I have Mandrake 9.1 running KDE as a little plaything. Quite honestly, I
>find it is very clunky and lacks the finesse of Windows (which initself
lacks
>the finesse of the Mac).

I recently tried installing Mandrake on an old Win98 machine with 64 meg
RAM
and a 1 gig harddrive. I eliminated every non-essential package I was
offered but still couldn't come up with enough room for a GUI; either KDE
or
Gnome. All I could get was the command line.

So much for the myth that Linux is lean and efficient compared to Windows.

William Meyer

Delphi Developer

2003-12-23 07:21:12 AM

Re: How bad is Kylix?

On 22-Dec-03, JQP said:

Quote

The one I was *given * was 3 CDs; Mandrake 9.2
Lucky me -- I ordered a cheap copy of 9.1, and 3 days later, they

announced 9.2 :-(
And the damned thing *still* won't work properly on my notebook!
--
Bill
--------
"You can not keep on doing things the old way and still get the benefits
of the new way." -- Thomas Sowell

JED

Delphi Developer

2003-12-23 07:29:13 AM

Re: How bad is Kylix?

William Meyer writes:

Quote

Mandrake, Caldera, and SuSE come nearest to getting it right.
I used to be a Mandrake user, guess it was the easiest to install when

I was getting started. I am now a SuSE user. At least they include a
DVD with the installation... 24 cd's or 1 DVD (actual number of cd's
may vary - <vtic>);

JQP

Delphi Developer

2003-12-23 07:50:52 AM

Re: How bad is Kylix?

"William Meyer" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes

Quote

How many CDs in the latest release? SuSE has made it pretty obvious
that they're outbloating MS. I think the last one I bought was 7 CDs.
The one I was *given * was 3 CDs; Mandrake 9.2

John van Nieuwkerk

Delphi Developer

2003-12-23 07:51:16 AM

Re: How bad is Kylix?

In other words, a Linux tool could succeed, but Kylix is the wrong tool.
It's a Windows tool.

Quote

In order to be successful in the Linux market Kylix must embrace the
strengths and approaches of the programmers that are working in Linux. I
do
believe there is a viable commercial market on Linux, the problem is that
it's not the traditional market that Delphi has succeeded in on Windows.

JQP

Delphi Developer

2003-12-23 08:05:00 AM

Re: How bad is Kylix?

"Mike Mormando" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes

Quote

Which would be now.
Kernal 2.6 was released just the other day.
Relatively speaking, kernel updates are a small part of the problem. There

is only 1 kernel and major updates are rather infrequent. In the meantime,
there are dozens of distros churning out new slightly incompatible versions
very few months. None of which are tested for binary compatibility.

JQP

Delphi Developer

2003-12-23 10:40:06 AM

Re: How bad is Kylix?

"John van Nieuwkerk" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes

Quote

In other words, a Linux tool could succeed, but Kylix is the wrong tool.
It's a Windows tool.
That remains to be seen doesn't it? Whether *any* commercial Linux tool can

succeed.

Michael Lehrman

Delphi Developer

2003-12-23 11:15:44 AM

Re: How bad is Kylix?

"Nick Hodges (TeamB)" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes

Quote

On 21 Dec 2003 16:46:22 -0700, "JED" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes:

>Not because it was a poor product, but because Borland had the nerve to
>charge for it.

I think that was the main problem.

In other words, you can not make money selling development tools to
Linux developers.

This may change in a not too distant future. It looks like Linux is going to

be a major player in the next upswing of corporate IT spending, and
particularly as a desktop OS.
ML

Kevin

Delphi Developer

2003-12-23 11:17:36 AM

Re: How bad is Kylix?

Thomas Mueller writes:

Quote

I think I'd upgrade to Kylix 4 if it ever becomes available and Borland
clearly states that they will continue working on the CLX. Unfortunately I
don't believe either is going to come true.
I would also upgrade to Kylix 4 if they improve deployment. I really

like Kylix- it is a very good product. And Linux is now a very good
alternative to Windows- even on the desktop.
Cheers,
Kevin.

Michael Lehrman

Delphi Developer

2003-12-23 11:23:38 AM

Re: How bad is Kylix?

"William Meyer" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes

Quote

On 22-Dec-03, JED said:
[snip]
I want to like Linux, I really do, but on the desk, it sucks.
[snip]

I said the same thing after trying SuSE 7, but changed my opinion after SuSE
9. It is a huge step forward. BTW, the Workstation has only 5 CDs and 1 DVD.
Installation from DVD is flawless.
ML

pNichols

Delphi Developer

2003-12-23 11:35:56 AM

Re: How bad is Kylix?

JQP writes:

Quote

"Mike Mormando" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
news:3fe77a35$XXXX@XXXXX.COM...
>Which would be now.
>Kernal 2.6 was released just the other day.

Relatively speaking, kernel updates are a small part of the problem.
There
is only 1 kernel and major updates are rather infrequent. In the
meantime, there are dozens of distros churning out new slightly
incompatible versions
very few months. None of which are tested for binary compatibility.
absolutely not true..

Michael Lehrman

Delphi Developer

2003-12-23 11:36:01 AM

Re: How bad is Kylix?

"Kevin" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes

Quote

Thomas Mueller writes:
>I think I'd upgrade to Kylix 4 if it ever becomes available and
Borland
>clearly states that they will continue working on the CLX. Unfortunately
I
>don't believe either is going to come true.

I would also upgrade to Kylix 4 if they improve deployment. I really
like Kylix- it is a very good product. And Linux is now a very good
alternative to Windows- even on the desktop.

Agreed, but it seems that CBuilderX is Borland's new Linux strategy.

John van Nieuwkerk

Delphi Developer

2003-12-23 11:42:53 AM

Re: How bad is Kylix?

Been hearing that for a few years now. It is slowly getting more share of
the desktop market, but I cant see it being anything other than miniscule
compared to Windows in the short/medium term.

Quote

This may change in a not too distant future. It looks like Linux is going
to
be a major player in the next upswing of corporate IT spending, and
particularly as a desktop OS.