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Captain Jake

Delphi Developer
 

Re: Delphi Bugs


2004-08-01 09:46:33 AM
delphi159
"Will DeWitt Jr." <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
<XXXX@XXXXX.COM>
Quote
Well, first, this isn't going to help this discussion at all-- the
point that was trying to be made was that Danny reported a "bug" and it
never got fixed. Whether or not he was treated with respect is besides
the point.
No, it is PRECISELY THE POINT. The point is how the software is adapted to user
needs and desires. Part of this involves how those users are treated.
If any commercial software developer publicly (or privately for that matter)
referred to a customer as a stupid whiner, they would be (rightfully) fired and
their professionalism
probably questioned by those around them.
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Thomas Edison

Delphi Developer

2004-08-01 09:48:46 AM

Re: Delphi Bugs

On 31 Jul 2004 18:27:53 -0700, Nick Hodges [TeamB] writes:
Quote
Thomas Edison writes:

>I don't want anything. I was simply pointing out that you were
 >putting up a smokescreen and that you are very good at doing it.
I guess I don't have any idea how to respond to that. I have pretty much
stuck to the topic at hand, I have agreed that I was wrong at first, I've
discussed the points you've made, and your conclusion is that I'm
"putting up a smoke screen".

That's pretty inventive, even for a guy named Thomas Edison.
I was talking about this:
"So wait a minute, Jake, are you saying that your original statement
wasn't correct. Are, you -- !! -- saying that it wasn't true! What?
This will really throw a monkey wrench in some peoples arguments."
Not anything else you've said.
I was simply commenting on the smoke screen that you (IMO) put up there and
mentioning that you're good at doing that.
 
Thomas Edison

Delphi Developer

2004-08-01 09:49:37 AM

Re: Delphi Bugs

On Sat, 31 Jul 2004 20:16:24 -0500, Captain Jake writes:
Quote
Thomas Edison <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
<k3e0fhz8k45s$XXXX@XXXXX.COM>
>Jake makes a real howler
It was only a howler to those who don't think Linux has any serious bugs or
shortcomings.
I disagree completely.
 

Captain Jake

Delphi Developer

2004-08-01 09:50:33 AM

Re: Delphi Bugs

"Will DeWitt Jr." <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
<XXXX@XXXXX.COM>
Quote
If we're to believe that Linux is bad and evil, then Indy is no better.
That it is a component and not a final product is irrelevant.
It is not irrelevant. The free availability of a tool is a lot different than
the free availability of something made with that tool. But as I said, I am
still figuring this out.
Also, I am not overjoyed with the pace of Indy development. I will tell you that.
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Thomas Edison

Delphi Developer

2004-08-01 09:51:32 AM

Re: Delphi Bugs

On Sat, 31 Jul 2004 19:53:00 -0500, Bob Dawson writes:
Quote
>Why are you mixing bugs and hardware support -- attempting to
 >confuse people into thinking that Linux has bugs in that it doesn't
 >support certain hardware?
Recognizing and driving hardware is the operating system's job. Maybe you
prefer 'primary function failure' to the term 'bug'?
Are you saying that a driver written for OSa should work on OSb (for which
it wasn't written) or else OSb has bugs?
 
Thomas Edison

Delphi Developer

2004-08-01 09:54:29 AM

Re: Delphi Bugs

On Sat, 31 Jul 2004 20:04:20 -0500, Bob Dawson writes:
Quote
"Thomas Edison" wrote
>This is just pure FUD, Jake, and you know it. Can you _prove_ to
 >me that the people who wrote Linux don't know what they're doing
 >and don't have their users' interests at heart?
Interesting question. Doubtful. OTOH, can you prove that much of Linux
wasn't written at IBM by folks with IBM's interests at heart?
I'm not in a position to prove anything, since I have not made any assertions
on the subject at hand.
On the other hand, if I were to say, for example, that Borland's
programmers don't understand their customers, you'd be in a position to ask
me for some kind of proof.
P.S.: can not Jake stand up for himself? Does he need his friends to help
here?
 
Nick Hodges [TeamB]

Delphi Developer

2004-08-01 09:59:44 AM

Re: Delphi Bugs

Thomas Edison writes:
Quote
I was talking about this:
Oh, okay.
Quote
I was simply commenting on the smoke screen that you (IMO) put up
there and mentioning that you're good at doing that.
Well, I don't think that was much of a smoke screen. I think it cut
right to the heart of one of the things going on here -- that folks are
taking things way too emotionally and arguing in an ad hominem fashion.
Somehow this all got to be as much about Jake as about the issue. But
that in and of itself /is/ one of the issues that Jake has been
espousing: that any criticism of Linux becomes "bashing", and that the
messenger gets shot.
--
Nick Hodges -- TeamB
Lemanix Corporation -- www.lemanix.com
Read my Blog -- www.lemanix.com/nick
 
Nick Hodges [TeamB]

Delphi Developer

2004-08-01 10:01:40 AM

Re: Delphi Bugs

Thomas Edison writes:
Quote
Are you saying that a driver written for OSa should work on OSb (for
which it wasn't written) or else OSb has bugs?
I can not speak for the others, but here's what I will say:
If I have pretty normal, generally popular hardware, and Linux won't
recognize it when I install it, then yes, as far as I am concerned,
Linux is "pretty lame".
--
Nick Hodges -- TeamB
Lemanix Corporation -- www.lemanix.com
Read my Blog -- www.lemanix.com/nick
 
Nick Hodges [TeamB]

Delphi Developer

2004-08-01 10:03:03 AM

Re: Delphi Bugs

Will DeWitt Jr. writes:
Quote
Good troll, nice troll, thank you for your comments.
Willl, come on, man, that is the best you can do? Jake's riposte was
good! I really did laugh out loud. You can come back with something
better than that.
;-)
--
Nick Hodges -- TeamB
Lemanix Corporation -- www.lemanix.com
Read my Blog -- www.lemanix.com/nick
 
Captain Jake

Delphi Developer

2004-08-01 10:05:15 AM

Re: Delphi Bugs

Thomas Edison <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
<mvypuoqfk4yr$XXXX@XXXXX.COM>
Quote
>from Windows to Linux in the first place. What do they get in Linux that they
 >can't get in
 >Windows?
A well-designed, secure OS, perhaps? As opposed to an OS that was designed
for ease of use primarily, with security considerations hacked on at the
end.
Interesting you should mention that. I personally know of more Linux systems
being hacked than Windows systems. But that is just one man's experience...
I run Windows XP on my laptop. I have never been hacked or had a virus destroy
anything. This laptop is on and connected to the internet roughly 15 hours a
day (no that is not a typo) and I never have to reboot. How much more secure
does an OS need to be? And setting up networking using XP is super-easy. I have
both ease of use AND security.
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Nick Hodges [TeamB]

Delphi Developer

2004-08-01 10:07:44 AM

Re: Delphi Bugs

Bob Dawson writes:
Quote
s one of the biggest ironies
of Linux that most of it was really written on order, by professional
developers on the payrolls of major corporations?
In the defense of OSS, there is nothing in the official 'ethos' of OSS
that says there's anything wrong with this. The bottom line for OSS is
that the /source must be free/ as in beer *and* as in speech at all
times.
In other words, IBM is well within the bounds of the GPL to do what
they are doing.
On the larger point, though, I agree. From where I sit, and I think I
am typical of many, Linux might as well be a closed source, commercial
product.
--
Nick Hodges -- TeamB
Lemanix Corporation -- www.lemanix.com
Read my Blog -- www.lemanix.com/nick
 
Captain Jake

Delphi Developer

2004-08-01 10:07:56 AM

Re: Delphi Bugs

Thomas Edison <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
<vmqno27zmb50$.jp7hv1wi636z$XXXX@XXXXX.COM>
Quote
On Sat, 31 Jul 2004 18:29:50 -0500, Captain Jake writes:

>In addition, that is exactly why people ought to avoid Linux and stick with
 >Windows (and Delphi!). It wasn't written by professional software developers
 >who know what they are doing and have the interests of users at heart.
This is just pure FUD, Jake, and you know it. Can you _prove_ to me that
the people who wrote Linux don't know what they're doing and don't have
their users' interests at heart?
I can prove it wasn't written by professional software developers. that is easy.
Linus was a university student when he wrote it. Professional software
developers have years of
experience in full life cycle development.
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Nick Hodges [TeamB]

Delphi Developer

2004-08-01 10:08:55 AM

Re: Delphi Bugs

Thomas Edison writes:
Quote
So Jake's bashing OSS in here, yet using it to help himself create
his CSS product.
There's that "bashing" word again. Everytime you make statements like
that, Thomas, it confirms in my mind that there is a large swath of
folks out there who are simply too emotionally invested in all this to
be able to think clearly about OSS.
--
Nick Hodges -- TeamB
Lemanix Corporation -- www.lemanix.com
Read my Blog -- www.lemanix.com/nick
 
Nick Hodges [TeamB]

Delphi Developer

2004-08-01 10:09:39 AM

Re: Delphi Bugs

Thomas Edison writes:
Quote
If Jake's the captain, we'd better all jump as soon as we see those
icebergs.
Uh oh, here we go. This was going along pretty well. When things get
down to this, I know the beneficial part of the conversation is winding
down.
--
Nick Hodges -- TeamB
Lemanix Corporation -- www.lemanix.com
Read my Blog -- www.lemanix.com/nick
 
Captain Jake

Delphi Developer

2004-08-01 10:10:31 AM

Re: Delphi Bugs

Thomas Edison <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
<mti7j61w371b$.14fjq77bm4r2r$XXXX@XXXXX.COM>
Quote
So Jake's bashing OSS in here, yet using it to help himself create his CSS
product.
Wow, your head must be spinning in a million directions trying to reconcile all
those misconceptions.
Do yourself a favor and note the difference between OSS and the claims made on
its behalf.
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