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Re: Moving from Delphi to C++


2003-12-16 02:39:26 AM
delphi66
"Nick Hodges (TeamB)" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
Quote
Kevin --

Purely for the sake of doing honor to logic here --

I have made no affirmative statements on this issue. Therefore, I
carry no burden of proving anything.
You are entirely correct, IMHO. But I think logic is not going to accomplish
much here.
 
 

Re: Moving from Delphi to C++

Quote
I don't think it is dying, but I do think that the days of using it to
build GUI client applications are coming to an end.

Unless you want to distribute a 20MB runtime and have it run on more
than one platform, you're right.
 

Re: Moving from Delphi to C++

Quote
Yes, it is going to take a while to die. But it sure is dying in the
application development and I am having so much fun watching it die.

well your PC application market is dying. You just dont know it yet.
Guess what 99% of the market is for smart appliances, phones and
PDA's?
 

Re: Moving from Delphi to C++

"Michael Caracena" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
Quote
As Kevin stated before:

"Unfortunately for us, Borland removed the original wording. The only
hint you have that it changed was the fact that it says "updated".

That was very true because they replaced the original Open Letter with
another one.
Is it just me or is the above argument entirely stupid? If Borland really
did take out wording that implied thatWin32 would no longer be supported, as
is claimed by some (confused) individuals, then doesn't this imply that they
DO NOT WANT TO CONVEY THE IMPRESSION THAT THEY ARE DROPPING WIN32 SUPPORT IN
DELPHI? Then what basis is there for the crackpot argument that Borland is
dropping Win32 support?
It looks to me like deliberate FUD. It definitely is not a logical argument.
 

Re: Moving from Delphi to C++

Quote
Please get your facts straight. DfDN can be ordered with Delphi 7 included.
Furthermore they have stated very publicly that there'll be *at least*
another update to DfW32.

I do have my facts straight. Delphi 8 doesnt come with a win32
compiler. Them releasing 8 without win32 support tells me they once
again aren't spending a lot of resources on their win32 efforts. I
find it completely acceptable that their solution is to bundle Delphi
7 instead.
Quote
Makes sense to me. Why would you *not* continue using Delphi 7 for now anyway?

Better question is why would I bother buying Delphi 8 at this point?
 

Re: Moving from Delphi to C++

"Michael Caracena" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
Quote
This indicates that they retracted ( they no longer acknowledge the
existence of the first Open Letter ) and published a new one in it's
place.

We cannot prove any statements what Borland stated in the first version
of the Open Letter until someone shows us that version.
Has the thought occurred to you that if it was retracted that it therefore
is not valid as proof of what Borland intends? Your argument falls apart
under its own weight.
 

Re: Moving from Delphi to C++

"Kevin Collins" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
Quote
So only if .NET is not successful will we continue to be supported?
If .NET is successful, MSFT will not be supporting Win32, thus relegating it
to legacy status. So you will be using legacy tools on a lagacy operating
system. That isn't much worsr than using new tools on a legacy operating
system.
Win32 is going away in a few years, just like 16-bit did. This is the way
the future of Windows has been decided by Bill Gates. And no matter what
happens, current copies of Delphi will continue to work on Win32 anyway. So
I don't see the whole point of your argument. Even if Borland did decide to
drop Win32 support, so what? Their current tools won't cease to work simply
because they decide that all new releases will target .NET (a decision that
thy have not yet made apparently).
 

Re: Moving from Delphi to C++

"Kevin Collins" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
Quote


>>that Borland does not hold that
>>position, and did not want it inferred.
>
>That is the exact truth. I +know+ this is true, because I was
>personally involved with discussing the reaction to the letter as
>first posted.

Why on earth didn't you just say so? You cannot say that my impression of
the letter was invalid since I apparently wasn't the only one. But you
cannot also accuse me of saying something that wasn't true when I didn't
know all the facts.
LOL. I love this argument. It is so whimsical. Look at the hilarious
assumptions built into it:
1) Impressions are correct if more than one person shares those impressions.
2) A person can't state something that isn't true, if he is ignorant of
the truth.
This is easily one of the most entertaining threads in a long time! Bring
the popcorn!
 

Re: Moving from Delphi to C++

"Mike Margerum" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
Quote
Kevin, your posts dont wrap properly in Agent.
His logic doesn't register in any newsreader.
 

Re: Moving from Delphi to C++

"Dennis Landi" <none[at]none.com>writes
Quote
Captain Jake, ease up on the heckling.
I am not heckling.
 

Re: Moving from Delphi to C++

On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 17:48:51 +0100, Eric Grange <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>
writes:
Quote
"Okay, you can smell smoke, but how that can lead
to suspecting a fire is lost on me"
It's more like --
"Okay, you are smelling smoke, but there is no smoke, and no fire any
where around here."
Nick Hodges - TeamB
Lemanix Corporation
Please always follow the newsgroup guidelines --
www.borland.com/newsgroups
 

Re: Moving from Delphi to C++

Mike Margerum writes:
Quote
>Please get your facts straight. DfDN can be ordered with Delphi 7 included.
>Furthermore they have stated very publicly that there'll be *at
>least* another update to DfW32.
>
I do have my facts straight. Delphi 8 doesnt come with a win32
compiler.
Mike, go to shop.borland.com, click on the Delphi link and READ. It is
*clearly* stated that Delphi 7 is included.
--
Wayne Niddery - Logic Fundamentals, Inc. (www.logicfundamentals.com)
RADBooks: www.logicfundamentals.com/RADBooks.html
"It is error alone which needs the support of government. Truth can
stand by itself." - Thomas Jefferson
 

Re: Moving from Delphi to C++

Captain Jake writes:
Quote

Has the thought occurred to you that if it was retracted that it therefore
is not valid as proof of what Borland intends? Your argument falls apart
under its own weight.

Perhaps I was wrong for not disclosing my point of view to you.
I wanted to see the first version of the Open Letter.
So I argued to have it disclosed in this public forum.
( I read this mainly from Google. )
Jeff Overcash published the Open Letter so we all could read it.
I was very successful in my arguments.
Sincerely,
Michael Caracena
 

Re: Moving from Delphi to C++

Okay, okay, here are two small exercices for you:
A) Having only double precision floating-point at your disposal,
and no knowledge if this precision is achieved via FPU or SSE2,
code a mathematical function returning results with double
precision accuracy (i.e. no garbage bits in the return value).
You are supposed to use hardware-accelerated floating point math,
not write an FPU emulator.
As for the function to code, well, a "weighted average" should
keep you busy for some time. I will leave more "interesting" maths
functions as an optionnal exercice.
B) Write a Delphi 8 example of usage of OpenGL VBO extension
(or the equivalent DirectX caps) in the streaming situations
on a modern graphics board (GFFX 5900, Radeon 9800, etc.),
suitable for use in skinning or animation situations.
Your executable should not be 10 times slower than the Delphi 7
equivalent.
C) Write a parser for an OpenOffice spreadsheet of medium size
(say 300 kB on disk, I am sure you've seen bigger spreadsheets)
that is able to open the file interactively on a standard office
machine, say 1 GHz, 128 MB of RAM, with the purpose of extracting
or adding data.
D7 application does it in under a second. No ASM involved,
only uses the VCL and RTL.
(OpenOffice internal format is XML, those 300 kB being a ZIP,
you can expect the raw, unzipped XML file to about 10-20 MB,
feel free to use whatever DOM/SAX you wish, though I may hint
you should use neither MS XML nor WideStrings if you wish to
achieve interactive times on the target machine).
Eric
 

Re: Moving from Delphi to C++

Captain Jake writes: new-fangled quoting
Your quoting style (>at the beginning of each paragraph, rather than the beginning of
each line) is confusing OE-quotefix.