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Re: Team B: Blind Faith or Blind Ignorance?


2003-10-04 07:28:34 AM
delphi266
"Rudy Velthuis (TeamB)" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
Quote
Ronald McDonald writes:

and the only way
to do that is to be very exact
Unlike what Borland does in their "open" letters. They should call them
"vague" letters!
- Dennis
 
 

Re: Team B: Blind Faith or Blind Ignorance?

Ronald McDonald writes:
Quote
Selling more "units" doesn't mean anything.
Why? Is each person working with more than one copy at a time?
Quote
I made this judgment based on the number of Delphi jobs I see
advertised in my local and national papers.
That might be an indicator if your nation was the only one in the world.
--
Dave Nottage (TeamB)
 

Re: Team B: Blind Faith or Blind Ignorance?

Ronald,
I think you need to look more at the online jobs and also you need to
understand companies. For example, the company I work for is now moving
quite a bit of development of other products to Delphi. Is it being posted
in the job markets of newpapers, etc.. No. But it is being posted online
at our corporate web site.
Our main product is written in JAVA using the Borland tools. However, I
have found out that some of our clients are now going to Delphi because of
the flexability, power and ease of use.
I do not think Delphi will be replaced or cast aside for many a year to
come. It has a loyal developers base that loves it. The only downside to
Delphi and it is really a Borland issue is marketing. Borland is like IBM.
Create great products, but do little marketing of it. Where as Microsoft
creates so so products, but their marketing is second to none.
Just my thoughts.
Jeff
"Ronald McDonald" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
Quote
Selling more "units" doesn't mean anything.

I made this judgment based on the number of Delphi jobs I see advertised
in my
local and national papers.
Sadly, it is all Java and C(++). I haven't seen a Delphi developers job for
a
good while now (not in abundance since 1997). Indeed, I have just done a
search
at monster.com for Delphi developers in the East Anglia region of the UK
and
found none. The number of units shipped does not reflect the number of
jobs out
there at the moment - and this is what is important.


"Jeff Overcash (TeamB)" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
news:3f7deae4$XXXX@XXXXX.COM...
>
>"Dave Nottage (TeamB)" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes:
>>Ronald McDonald writes:
>>>The number of developers using Delphi is slowly diminishing.
>>
>>This is the kind of statement that when someone disagrees with you
>>(again regardless of whether they're in TeamB) or not, or asks for some
>>proof of the claim, that people cry "blind faith" or "blind ignorance".
>>
>
>Worse. Ronald's statment is a flat out lie. John Kaster on this
>group has stated that Delphi 7 has shipped the most units and
>generated the most revenue of any Delphi version. There is no
>way you have a deminishing user base but ship more units. You
>have to have a growing user base to ship more units.


 

Re: Team B: Blind Faith or Blind Ignorance?

Rudy Velthuis (TeamB) writes:
Quote
Ingvar Nilsen writes:


>My impression too, that is why I have been using the expression
>"TApologist".


Which is a very insulting term. Please defer from using it for TeamB.

As is accusing me for "making wild assumptions". I am able to think and
I am not doing that. Please defer from using it for me.
--
Ingvar Nilsen
 

Re: Team B: Blind Faith or Blind Ignorance?

Ingvar Nilsen writes:
Quote
Rudy Velthuis (TeamB) writes:
>Ingvar Nilsen writes:
>
>
>>My impression too, that is why I have been using the expression
>>"TApologist".
>
>
>Which is a very insulting term. Please defer from using it for TeamB.
>
As is accusing me for "making wild assumptions".
I don't think so.
--
Rudy Velthuis (TeamB)
Customer: "I'm running Windows '95."
Tech: "Yes."
Customer: "My computer isn't working now."
Tech: "Yes, you said that."
 

Re: Team B: Blind Faith or Blind Ignorance?

Dennis Jones writes:
Quote
Unlike what Borland does in their "open" letters. They should call them
"vague" letters!
I didn't think the last one was vague.
--
Rudy Velthuis (TeamB)
"You can pretend to be serious; you can not pretend to be witty."
- Sacha Guitry (1885-1957)
 

Re: Team B: Blind Faith or Blind Ignorance?

Ronald McDonald writes:
Quote

What are your thoughts on this?

You are placing far too much emphasis on the FUD spread here by a (more
than likely) negligible number of people.
Don
 

Re: Team B: Blind Faith or Blind Ignorance?

I agree with you on the point that Borland is like IBM, makes
excellent products, but don't offer them so much in the market...
But I have to give another point of view: Piracy. In the begining
Microsoft let people copy Windows, Office, and people were using them
a lot of time without having to pay. What it happened then? Simply:
People get costumed to use the Microsoft software and most of the
users are not software experts. Even if they find better products
like Corel WordPerfect Office, Linux, cheaper, people is so blind that
prefers to pay twice the price. Why? costumed!. And this is going
through. current people, and first degree university students count
on using piracy software, and what do technicians install on the PCs?
:
Windows-MSOffice-Visual Basic! Students get costumed to use VB
instead of Delphi, and if you ask a current student about Delphi,
he/she doesn't know it existed!. that is why most of people use other
tools instead of Delphi (simply ignorancy). I started programming in
Basic, but when I learned Pascal, I felt in love with it, I learned C
and C++ and I stayed in Delphi, why? it is easier and almost the same
speed!
I suggest Borland go to the universities around the world and give
people Delphi for 6 months free using and after that time, ask for a
registration. Let people talk about borland products by themselves.
People is not so stupid, when they encounter a better tool like
Delphi, people don't run back to VB.
Edgar Rodriguez
XXXX@XXXXX.COM
 

Re: Team B: Blind Faith or Blind Ignorance?

"Rudy Velthuis (TeamB)" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
Quote
Dennis Jones writes:

>Unlike what Borland does in their "open" letters. They should call them
>"vague" letters!

I didn't think the last one was vague.
Perhaps....if you are referring the most recent Delphi letter (which I have
not read myself), my understanding is that it does indeed contain more
substantive information.
However, I was speaking in more general terms about the *typical* content of
"open" letters we've seen from Borland recently. A second case in point --
the BCB letter. And now that there has been an uproar about it too, maybe
we'll get a more substantive letter from Borland about BCB's future! But,
as usual, they'll just be "closing the barn door after the horse gets out."
- Dennis
 

Re: Team B: Blind Faith or Blind Ignorance?

"Rudy Velthuis (TeamB)" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
Quote
Dennis Landi writes:

>They are clearly as in the dark as everybody else,

What makes you think so?
--
As far as I am concerned you having taken it upon yourself to act as a
vociferous parrot of what you think is Borland's corporate line in what you
think is a supportive act.
I think you do more harm to Borland's image then you do GOOD. If you
actually had information with which to clarify an issue, that would be one
thing. But your endless messages on the subject of parsing the english
language in order to divine the REAL MEANING of what was said or not said
from this or that quote is just incredibly sophomoric and TIRESOME.
You generate more noise in this forum than even Rosco.
Clear?
-dennis
 

Re: Team B: Blind Faith or Blind Ignorance?

Dennis Jones writes:
Quote
Perhaps....if you are referring the most recent Delphi letter (which I
have not read myself), my understanding is that it does indeed contain
more substantive information.
I meant the one posted a few days ago on BDN. I will not comment on CBX
here.
--
Rudy Velthuis (TeamB)
"University politics are vicious precisely because the stakes are so
small."
- Henry Kissinger (1923-)
 

Re: Team B: Blind Faith or Blind Ignorance?

Dennis Landi writes:
Quote
As far as I am concerned you having taken it upon yourself to act as a
vociferous parrot of what you think is Borland's corporate line in what
you think is a supportive act.
No, I simply personally object to any statement that is clearly not based
on any facts. You have absolutely no idea what I know and what I don't
know, or what other TeamB members know. So I think I am entitled to ask
what makes you think we are in the dark.
Quote
I think you do more harm to Borland's image then you do GOOD.
That may be. I don't.
But I think that the FUD and unfounded babble going on here do Borland
more harm than anything I or fellow Teamb members say.
--
Rudy Velthuis (TeamB)
"Life is like a box of chocolates." -- Forest Gump
 

Re: Team B: Blind Faith or Blind Ignorance?

"Dennis Landi" <none[at]none.com>writes news:XXXX@XXXXX.COM...
|
| - Rudy Velthius, October 2, 2003
| (a dentist from the Netherlands)
Such things could be interpreted as insulting. Please do not do it.
 

Re: Team B: Blind Faith or Blind Ignorance?

"Rudy Velthuis (TeamB)" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
| Dennis Jones writes:
|
|>Unlike what Borland does in their "open" letters. They should call them
|>"vague" letters!
|
| I didn't think the last one was vague.
The paragraph at the end about win32 was so vague it might as well have been labelled
"Disclaimer".
 

Re: Team B: Blind Faith or Blind Ignorance?

John Pressman writes:
Quote
"Dennis Landi" <none[at]none.com>writes
news:XXXX@XXXXX.COM...
>
>- Rudy Velthius, October 2, 2003
>(a dentist from the Netherlands)

Such things could be interpreted as insulting. Please do not do it.
The only slight insult is the wrong spelling of my name. I don't mind
being called Dutch, or a dentist. <vbg>
--
Rudy Velthuis (TeamB)
"Sometimes a scream is better than a thesis."
- Ralph Waldo Emerson (1803-1882)