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Re: Delphi 2006 Trial


2006-01-17 06:36:29 AM
delphi93
I am very much of the opinion that a free Personal Edition would be A Good
Thing.
Why?
Some people here are familiar with the Delphi column which I wrote monthly
for ten years for PC Plus magazine. That column started because Borland
provided PC Plus with a free copy of Delphi 1 (and later provided the
magazine with free copies of other editions). Without Delphi on the cover
disc, PC Plus would not have run that column - I can tell you that for a
fact. The sole reason for the column was having the software on the cover
CD. That was an editorial decision. No software, no column.
That's about 120 Delphi columns (not to mention all kinds of additional
Delphi tutorials) which simply would never have been published.
Let's bring this up to date.
At the moment I am planning a number of programming tutorials for my online
magazine, Bitwise. My instinct is to go for Delphi. But in so doing I know
that I'd be talking mainly to existing Delphi programmers. I'd not
be attracting new programmers or people using other languages because there
is no simple (free or very cheap) means for them to try it out.
On the other hand, if you want to try out C# you can download a free
compiler and IDE from Microsoft. So I can write tutorials for C# in the
knowledge that anyone can follow along because they can download all the
sofrware they need.
This poses me with a dilemma. I like Delphi. I would like to write tutorials for
Delphi. I would like to encourage people programming in other languages to 'give
Delphi a try'. But the the software isn't there for people to just 'give it
a go'. It is there for C#.
Do I let my heart rule my decision (I personally like Delphi) or my head (I
know that everyone can get the C# software for free)?
The perfect solution would, of course, be for Borland to release a free
Delphi 2006 IDE. Then I could put all my efforts into Delphi tutorials in
the expectation that people would download the software and just give it a
try.
I am still hoping ;-)
best wishes
Huw Collingbourne
================================
Bitwise Magazine
www.bitwisemag.com
Dark Neon Ltd.
================================
 
 

Re: Delphi 2006 Trial

Quote
its not out yet
Which seems a bad idea to me:
blog.marcocantu.com/blog/d2006trial.html
- Marco Cantu (author Mastering Borland Delphi 2005)
www.marcocantu.com
--- posted by geoForum on delphi.newswhat.com
 

Re: Delphi 2006 Trial

Huw Collingbourne writes:
Quote
The perfect solution would, of course, be for Borland to release a
free Delphi 2006 IDE. Then I could put all my efforts into Delphi
tutorials in the expectation that people would download the software
and just give it a try.
Even if like the open source kylix it did a small box saying "Made with
Borland Delphi Personal" or something briefly on startup, I think it
would be incredibly useful for people.
--
Liz the Brit
Delphi things I have released: www.xcalibur.co.uk/DelphiThings
 

Re: Delphi 2006 Trial

Liz writes:
Quote
Huw Collingbourne writes:


>The perfect solution would, of course, be for Borland to release a
>free Delphi 2006 IDE. Then I could put all my efforts into Delphi
>tutorials in the expectation that people would download the software
>and just give it a try.


Even if like the open source kylix it did a small box saying "Made with
Borland Delphi Personal" or something briefly on startup, I think it
would be incredibly useful for people.
The first thing an avid programmer wannabe would want to learn, and in
fact soon accomplish with Delphi, is to get rid of such a box <g>
I gave up Borland Marketing years ago. Borland's (Delphi) marketing
asset the last 11 years in Europe has been Huw Collingbourne <g>
--
Ingvar Nilsen
www.ingvarius.com
 

Re: Delphi 2006 Trial

There will be a Trial version. Note this statement from the download
site: "...Please note that trial downloads for Delphi?2006 will be
posted here soon...."
www.borland.com/downloads/download_delphi.html
 

Re: Delphi 2006 Trial

Rod kirjoitti:
Quote
There will be a Trial version. Note this statement from the download
site: "...Please note that trial downloads for Delphi?2006 will be
posted here soon...."
BTW that statement has been there for over a month now, so don't hold
your breath...
David S.
 

Re: Delphi 2006 Trial

Deborah Pate (TeamB) writes:
Quote
<<Huw Collingbourne:
With time-limited software, they feel that they only have
time to have a superficial look at it - and many people
won't even think that the effort of installing it is
worthwhile.
The other problem is that if they have 30 days they cant always be sure
to have tried all they want and dedicate all the time they have to it
in that 30 days..
heck many years on theres still plenty of delphi I dont know..
especially now with 2006 having so many personalities.
--
Liz the Brit
Delphi things I have released: www.xcalibur.co.uk/DelphiThings
 

Re: Delphi 2006 Trial

Huw Collingbourne writes:
Quote
I am very much of the opinion that a free Personal Edition would be A
Good
Thing.
Kudos to you and Marco for bringing up a lot of good strategic points
about why, done properly, this can be a good business move for Borland.
Obviously, this can be more motivating to Borland than just hearing from
some hobbyist or shareware author who thinks that Borland owes them free
or cheap software for life.
Quote
I am still hoping ;-)
So am I. A while back, someone from Borland hinted that something "better
than Personal" was in the works. I am hoping that it materializes.
For the sake of completeness, let me ask whether you would be motivated
to write those articles if people could at least easily obtain the trial
version. Or do you feel it needs to be a version that does not expire
after 30 days? I am thinking the trial version alone may not do the job,
but I would like to hear your thoughts.
Rick Carter
XXXX@XXXXX.COM
Chair, Delphi/Paradox SIG, Cincinnati PC Users Group
--- posted by geoForum on delphi.newswhat.com
 

Re: Delphi 2006 Trial

Quote
For the sake of completeness, let me ask whether you would be motivated
to write those articles if people could at least easily obtain the trial
version. Or do you feel it needs to be a version that does not expire
after 30 days? I am thinking the trial version alone may not do the job,
but I would like to hear your thoughts.

My own preference is very strongly for software that does not expire. In
fact, I believe it would be very much better to have a much cut-down
Personal Edition with no time-limit than a full-blown Architect that bombs
out after a certain period.
In my experience, the only software that generates long running columns in
magazines has been software that does not have an expiry date. In my time
with PC Plus, I also wrote a Java column for three years based on a
non-expiring copy of Visual Cafe. The Delphi column ran for much longer - a)
because Borland kept providing new non-expiring versions of Delphi and b)
because the readers seemed to like it ;-)
At the moment, looking at this from a purely pragmatic viewpoint, I have to
say that I'd not be prepared to put the effort into a long-running
tutorial series (that is, a series aimed at programmers who are new to
Delphi) on the basis of a time-limited product. There are two reasons for
this:
1) If my series runs a year, why would people be tempted to follow it if
they know in advance that the software will bomb out after thirty days? Most
people simply won't bother.
2) From long experience in writing programming columns and tutorials, I know
that you never get any sense of e{*word*277}ment from features based around
time-limited software. This is perceived to be a 'demo' and the columnist or
magazine is perceived to be 'in cahoots' with the software company. Even
when no money has exchanged hands, readers often think (and they tell you
this too!) that the software company is paying for publicity and the writer
is just doing a marketing job for the benefit of the software company rather
than for the benefit of the reader/programmer.
With non time-limited software, people feel that it may be worth putting
some serious effort into using it over a long enough period to follow a
fairly in-depth tutorial series and really get to know the software. With
time-limited software, they feel that they only have time to have a
superficial look at it - and many people won't even think that the effort of
installing it is worthwhile.
Moreover, since Microsoft is now giving away programming products of
considerable power, this inevitably must add to people's reluctance to
install 'try out' software from other vendors.
best wishes
Huw Collingbourne
================================
Bitwise Magazine
www.bitwisemag.com
Dark Neon Ltd.
================================
 

Re: Delphi 2006 Trial

Rick,
Quote
Yes, this is what makes it a real challenge for Borland, since Visual
Studio is better than ever before, and the express editions are available
for free. The dilemma is that Borland has to make a profit selling its
programming software, since it doesn't make money selling operating
systems or office suites. But a stripped-down BDS 2006 IDE without
some of the key features like refactoring and live templates would not
really demonstrate how much more productive one can be in BDS as opposed
to VS.
YES! IMHO, every SKU must cover the principles of programming today - at least to some extent. A complete IDE includes Modeling, refactoring and version control at minimum. These principals shouldn't be the differing factors in SKUs but different levels of them could. Borland has to be careful to provide a more thorough environment than anyone else in order for it to be the one everyone wants to work in - even (perhaps specifically) at the person level. Having said that I believe that people will accept any Person edition at this point. Just getting into the 2006 IDE at any level and you never want to leave - I love it. The modeling and refactoring that are available in the Pro SKU lead me to think that Borland is on this path and it might take a bit for it all to filter down .... I certainly hope so.
--
Dave Keighan
XanaNewser [ 1.17.6.6]
 

Re: Delphi 2006 Trial

<<Huw Collingbourne:
With time-limited software, they feel that they only have
time to have a superficial look at it - and many people
won't even think that the effort of installing it is
worthwhile.
Quote
>
<raises hand>
--
Deborahs continuing mission is to remove Englishs
possessive apostrophes
 

Re: Delphi 2006 Trial

Huw,
Quote
>But a stripped-down BDS 2006 IDE without
>some of the key features like refactoring and live templates would not
>really demonstrate how much more productive one can be in BDS as opposed
>to VS.

To be honest, for a complete newcomer to Delphi I don't think that is the vital issue. The first thing they need to do is get programming something, anything with it - just to get the feel of the software and arrive at an impression as to whether they think this is quality stuff and whether it is something they could 'live with' over time. The bells and whistles of the full versions are certainly something people might want to explore later on. But, frankly, until they start doing a bit of real programming (rather than the 'ten minute demo' or walk-through) the finer points and all the latest features are irrelevant. it is getting people's programming fingers working on Delphi in the first place that is single most important step....
I disagree, unfortunately I am unable to come up with a suitable metaphor that proves my case instead of yours. I believe that using modeling, refactoring and version control are in fact the basics, not bells and whistles only suitable to the higher SKUs. You should start out modeling an application, be able to refactor your code as required and always use source control. Unfortunately for my position I do, on the other hand, see your point. it is been a great debate, thank-you very much for taking part <vb grin>.
--
Dave Keighan
XanaNewser [ 1.17.6.6]
 

Re: Delphi 2006 Trial

Quote
But a stripped-down BDS 2006 IDE without
some of the key features like refactoring and live templates would not
really demonstrate how much more productive one can be in BDS as opposed
to VS.

To be honest, for a complete newcomer to Delphi I don't think that is the
vital issue. The first thing they need to do is get programming something,
*anything* with it - just to get the feel of the software and arrive at an
impression as to whether they think this is quality stuff and whether it is
something they could 'live with' over time. The bells and whistles of the
full versions are certainly something people might want to explore later on.
But, frankly, until they start doing a bit of real programming (rather than
the 'ten minute demo' or walk-through) the finer points and all the latest
features are irrelevant. it is getting people's programming fingers working
on Delphi in the first place that is single most important step....
all the best
Huw Collingbourne
================================
Bitwise Magazine
www.bitwisemag.com
Dark Neon Ltd.
================================
 

Re: Delphi 2006 Trial

Huw Collingbourne writes:
Quote
With non time-limited software, people feel that it may be worth putting
some serious effort into using it over a long enough period to follow a
fairly in-depth tutorial series and really get to know the software. With
time-limited software, they feel that they only have time to have a
superficial look at it - and many people won't even think that the
effort of
installing it is worthwhile.
Right. I am with you and Deb on this one.
Quote
Moreover, since Microsoft is now giving away programming products of
considerable power, this inevitably must add to people's reluctance to
install 'try out' software from other vendors.
Yes, this is what makes it a real challenge for Borland, since Visual
Studio is better than ever before, and the express editions are available
for free. The dilemma is that Borland has to make a profit selling its
programming software, since it doesn't make money selling operating
systems or office suites. But a stripped-down BDS 2006 IDE without
some of the key features like refactoring and live templates would not
really demonstrate how much more productive one can be in BDS as opposed
to VS.
Rick Carter
XXXX@XXXXX.COM
Chair, Delphi/Paradox SIG, Cincinnati PC Users Group
--- posted by geoForum on delphi.newswhat.com
 

Re: Delphi 2006 Trial

Marco Cantu writes:
Quote

Which seems a bad idea to me:
blog.marcocantu.com/blog/d2006trial.html
I agree Marco. You would have thought with all the good word of mouth
adverti{*word*224}t that D2006 is receiving that Borland would want to get a
trial in the hands of those non-Delphians who are interested in switching.
I have another thought. Why doesn't Borland unbundle BDS? In other
words, make a Delphi Pro Win32 version, a Delphi Pro .Net version, a
C++Builder version and a C# version and sell each for under $300.00?
This way you wouldn't be forced to buy personalities that you would
never use or only those that you would use and if you need all four,
then you buy BDS?
Borland Marketing, Are you listening?
Mark