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Delphi & Clarion

Sorry for asking this question but I know next to nothing about it.
What's the difference between Delphi and Clarion? Are they just
different tools for the same purpose? That is to say, can you write
database application with both of them?
Once again, sorry if my question is totally off the mark.
kong
 

Re:Delphi & Clarion


Not a simple question to answer. In essence both are development tools and
allow you to rapidly develop database apps. The essential difference is that
Delphi is a general purpose development environment and can be used for a
very wide range of application types. Clarion has a narrower focus and is
mostly suitable for db apps. Another difference is that Delphi will pretty
much allow you to do what you want with few limitations, especially in terms
of user interface and db access. Clarion is much more restrictive.  Delphi
works with almost any database. The price for working with such a
sophisticated tool is that there is more to learn - but only if you want to
take advantage of the features.
Quote
Kong wrote in message <36b124a3.1919...@news.jaring.my>...
>Sorry for asking this question but I know next to nothing about it.
>What's the difference between Delphi and Clarion? Are they just
>different tools for the same purpose? That is to say, can you write
>database application with both of them?
>Once again, sorry if my question is totally off the mark.
>kong

Re:Delphi & Clarion


On Sat, 30 Jan 1999 01:18:04 -0500, "Bruce Roberts"

Quote
<ROBERTS_BROWNE_LIMI...@email.msn.com> wrote:
>Not a simple question to answer. In essence both are development tools and
>allow you to rapidly develop database apps. The essential difference is that
>Delphi is a general purpose development environment and can be used for a
>very wide range of application types. Clarion has a narrower focus and is
>mostly suitable for db apps. Another difference is that Delphi will pretty
>much allow you to do what you want with few limitations, especially in terms
>of user interface and db access. Clarion is much more restrictive.  Delphi
>works with almost any database. The price for working with such a
>sophisticated tool is that there is more to learn - but only if you want to
>take advantage of the features.

I am still  using Pdox3.5. Looked at Access97 but not decided yet.
Someone suggested Delphi or Clarion hence my initial question. Being
the lazy type yet wanting to learn something new so here is my next
question and hope somebody could help me out again: Which is more user
friendly or easier to learn? Delphi or Clarion for mainly db
application.
Thanks in advance.
kong

Re:Delphi & Clarion


A huge huge plus for Delphi is all the tools that are available.  Im talking
Native tools, written in 100% delphi. You could use activex's as well, but
there is nothing like native.

The Newsgroups are real active as well. I think even more than VB.

--
Gordon Hamm
Voice Data Systems Inc.
360-686-8315

Quote
Kong wrote in message <36b3b773.10330...@news.jaring.my>...

On Sat, 30 Jan 1999 01:18:04 -0500, "Bruce Roberts"

Quote
<ROBERTS_BROWNE_LIMI...@email.msn.com> wrote:
>Not a simple question to answer. In essence both are development tools and
>allow you to rapidly develop database apps. The essential difference is
that
>Delphi is a general purpose development environment and can be used for a
>very wide range of application types. Clarion has a narrower focus and is
>mostly suitable for db apps. Another difference is that Delphi will pretty
>much allow you to do what you want with few limitations, especially in
terms
>of user interface and db access. Clarion is much more restrictive.  Delphi
>works with almost any database. The price for working with such a
>sophisticated tool is that there is more to learn - but only if you want to
>take advantage of the features.

I am still  using Pdox3.5. Looked at Access97 but not decided yet.
Someone suggested Delphi or Clarion hence my initial question. Being
the lazy type yet wanting to learn something new so here is my next
question and hope somebody could help me out again: Which is more user
friendly or easier to learn? Delphi or Clarion for mainly db
application.
Thanks in advance.
kong

Re:Delphi & Clarion


Quote
Kong wrote:

> Which is more user
> friendly or easier to learn? Delphi or Clarion for mainly db
> application.

As someone suggested, there's no simple answer to give. It's like "which
is easier to learn, Russian or Greek, or maybe Malaysian."

No matter which you choose, Delphi or Clarion, you'll see some progress
in one week. Take some DB demo that came with those packages, and you'll
soon be able to make your own modifications, and maybe small apps
also. Good personal Phone Book application in less than 2 weeks, no matter
which you choose.

I have seen some quite big commercial apps done with Clarion, and even
bigger done with Delphi. Both seemed to work all right, and were under
heavy daily use.
If you want to make your living with those tools for the next 5..10 years,
you probably (??) can do it with both of those. But I sure can't say which
tool will hit some limit after 2 years and which don't.

It's also quite sure, that you have to write work arounds, and live with
some limitiations anyway, no matter which tool you choosed. We on this
newsgroup have choosen Delphi, for some reason, and those otheres have
chosen VB, PBuilder, Clarion etc. for some other reasons.

Markku Nevalainen

Re:Delphi & Clarion


For simple db apps Clarion is probably simpler to learn. However you'll find
that spending just a little more time to learn Delphi will pay big
dividends. For simple db apps, Delphi is pretty easy. The bonus being that
you can develop much more sophisticated apps with Delphi, and you can use
Delphi for a wider range of applications. My vote would be for Delphi, but
then I'm an enthusiast.

Quote
Kong wrote in message <36b3b773.10330...@news.jaring.my>...
>On Sat, 30 Jan 1999 01:18:04 -0500, "Bruce Roberts"
><ROBERTS_BROWNE_LIMI...@email.msn.com> wrote:

>>Not a simple question to answer. In essence both are development tools and
>>allow you to rapidly develop database apps. The essential difference is
that
>>Delphi is a general purpose development environment and can be used for a
>>very wide range of application types. Clarion has a narrower focus and is
>>mostly suitable for db apps. Another difference is that Delphi will pretty
>>much allow you to do what you want with few limitations, especially in
terms
>>of user interface and db access. Clarion is much more restrictive.  Delphi
>>works with almost any database. The price for working with such a
>>sophisticated tool is that there is more to learn - but only if you want
to
>>take advantage of the features.
>I am still  using Pdox3.5. Looked at Access97 but not decided yet.
>Someone suggested Delphi or Clarion hence my initial question. Being
>the lazy type yet wanting to learn something new so here is my next
>question and hope somebody could help me out again: Which is more user
>friendly or easier to learn? Delphi or Clarion for mainly db
>application.
>Thanks in advance.
>kong

Re:Delphi & Clarion


On Sun, 31 Jan 1999 00:41:36 -0500, "Bruce Roberts"

Quote
<ROBERTS_BROWNE_LIMI...@email.msn.com> wrote:
>For simple db apps Clarion is probably simpler to learn. However you'll find
>that spending just a little more time to learn Delphi will pay big
>dividends. For simple db apps, Delphi is pretty easy. The bonus being that
>you can develop much more sophisticated apps with Delphi, and you can use
>Delphi for a wider range of applications. My vote would be for Delphi, but
>then I'm an enthusiast.

O.K. I am interested so have to start somewhere. I am still using
Pdox3.5 for my invoicing/inventory program but relies extensively on
scripts and doing a lot of ad hoc query. So I have some knowledge of
database design but hardly any experience in the so-called SQL.  Based
on those experiences, could someone please suggest some appropriate
reading materials to take me by the hand and guide me thro'?  A book
that would at least be for beginner to mid level?
Or have anyone read one of the early Paradox book, The Best Book of
Paradox 3 by Celeste Robinson? I find that book of immense help
especially because it take the reader through the process of creating
an Invoicing and inventory program and that's is EXACTLY what I
wanted. If there is a similar book for Delphi, I will surely go for
it.
Thanks in advance for the advice.
kong

Re:Delphi & Clarion


Hi Kong

Don't jump too fast. Put the same question to comp.lang.clarion or one of the
many other Clarion forums. You'll find that persons who actually USE Clarion have
a different opinion.

For database apps Clarion is remarkable. In addition, its OOP is really
something. For my part I am an ex Assembly and C programmer, but I haven't yet
needed to use them in Clarion.

Clarion is a 4GL that gives you full access to C++, Assembler and Modula 2 if you
need them, and you can use APIs to your hearts content.

Not knocking Delphi, guys, I have it, and its a lovely language - but for someone
who is focussing on Database apps Clarion is a very good bet!

Cheers (putting on Fire-Proof Garments)....

Quote
Kong wrote:
> On Sun, 31 Jan 1999 00:41:36 -0500, "Bruce Roberts"
> <ROBERTS_BROWNE_LIMI...@email.msn.com> wrote:

> >For simple db apps Clarion is probably simpler to learn. However you'll find
> >that spending just a little more time to learn Delphi will pay big
> >dividends. For simple db apps, Delphi is pretty easy. The bonus being that
> >you can develop much more sophisticated apps with Delphi, and you can use
> >Delphi for a wider range of applications. My vote would be for Delphi, but
> >then I'm an enthusiast.
> O.K. I am interested so have to start somewhere. I am still using
> Pdox3.5 for my invoicing/inventory program but relies extensively on
> scripts and doing a lot of ad hoc query. So I have some knowledge of
> database design but hardly any experience in the so-called SQL.  Based
> on those experiences, could someone please suggest some appropriate
> reading materials to take me by the hand and guide me thro'?  A book
> that would at least be for beginner to mid level?
> Or have anyone read one of the early Paradox book, The Best Book of
> Paradox 3 by Celeste Robinson? I find that book of immense help
> especially because it take the reader through the process of creating
> an Invoicing and inventory program and that's is EXACTLY what I
> wanted. If there is a similar book for Delphi, I will surely go for
> it.
> Thanks in advance for the advice.
> kong

--
Eric Churton
Simplified Software
From DURBAN, South Africa, where the FUN never sets!

Re:Delphi & Clarion


Quote
Eric Churton wrote in message <36B5B794.2C2B5...@iafrica.com>...
>Hi Kong

>Don't jump too fast. Put the same question to comp.lang.clarion or one of
the
>many other Clarion forums. You'll find that persons who actually USE
Clarion have
>a different opinion.

>Not knocking Delphi, guys, I have it, and its a lovely language - but for
someone
>who is focussing on Database apps Clarion is a very good bet!

Good advice. Clarion is a good product, plus database is not, IMHO, the best
feature of Delphi (witness the innumerable replacements for BDE, which would
not exist if BDE was adequate, the anguished cries about simple stuff like
master detail or autoincrement keys, etc.)

Robert

Re:Delphi & Clarion


Quote
>Good advice. Clarion is a good product, plus database is not, IMHO, the best
>feature of Delphi (witness the innumerable replacements for BDE, which would
>not exist if BDE was adequate, the anguished cries about simple stuff like
>master detail or autoincrement keys, etc.)

>Robert

One of main reason why I haven't thought of Clarion is the relative
lack of activities on the net. That would mean relative lack of help
sources. (That's is what I like about the net and thanks, netcitizen).
Been to Amazon.com and couldn't find a single book about Clarion and
my news server doesn't even access comp.lang.clarion. Maybe someone
could enlighten me with some useful www for Clarion?
Now your comment about maser detail or autoincrement keys really
worries me. In my limited database knowledge, those are THE important
stuff and if Delphi/BDE has problem with those, should I take the
plunge?
Some more advise please.
kong

Re:Delphi & Clarion


One has to remember that the BDE provides access to a variety of different
databases. As far as i'm aware, the autoincrement key problem only occurs in
the primary key of a paradox table.  A huge advantage of the BDE is that is
allows you to change the underlying db with little or no re-coding. Thus,
for example, you can have a small site using paradox or dbase and a large
site using oracle or interbase (theoretically).

The other thing to keep in mind is that while a perusal of various delphi
database newsgroups will reveal a number of problems and complaints the fact
is that this shows there are a huge number of people using the product and
they like to talk about it. Other, less popular, products can't provide that
kind of peer group support. Every product has problems and i tend to prefer
one where the problems are out in the open, rather than having to discover
them myself.

Quote
Kong wrote in message <36b65f3d.7672...@news.jaring.my>...

>>Good advice. Clarion is a good product, plus database is not, IMHO, the
best
>>feature of Delphi (witness the innumerable replacements for BDE, which
would
>>not exist if BDE was adequate, the anguished cries about simple stuff like
>>master detail or autoincrement keys, etc.)

>>Robert
>One of main reason why I haven't thought of Clarion is the relative
>lack of activities on the net. That would mean relative lack of help
>sources. (That's is what I like about the net and thanks, netcitizen).
>Been to Amazon.com and couldn't find a single book about Clarion and
>my news server doesn't even access comp.lang.clarion. Maybe someone
>could enlighten me with some useful www for Clarion?
>Now your comment about maser detail or autoincrement keys really
>worries me. In my limited database knowledge, those are THE important
>stuff and if Delphi/BDE has problem with those, should I take the
>plunge?
>Some more advise please.
>kong

Re:Delphi & Clarion


Quote
>One of main reason why I haven't thought of Clarion is the relative
>lack of activities on the net. That would mean relative lack of help
>sources. (That's is what I like about the net and thanks, netcitizen).

The help on usenet & compuserve is awsome!

Quote
>Been to Amazon.com and couldn't find a single book about Clarion and
>my news server doesn't even access comp.lang.clarion.

Try topspeeds public news server:   tsnews.clarion.com

Quote
> Maybe someone
>could enlighten me with some useful www for Clarion?

www.topspeed.com

Large list of links:  http://www.clarion.org.au/links/index.html

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