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2004-02-16 05:05:08 AM
delphi64
Whil this could be construed as off-topic, I think it is appropriate to
introduce it here due to the frequent references to the concepts
mentioned in this article, as it pertains to Delphi and Borland's
actions WRT Delphi customers.
www.retailernews.com/1198/phill118.html
--
John Kaster, Borland Developer Relations, bdn.borland.com
Add a feature/Fix a bug: qc.borland.com
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Interesting article.
Boiled down it says "make people feel good about the product and the
supplier".
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"John Kaster (Borland)" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes

John Kaster (Borland) writes:
I was in the discussion, when the presenter asked, 'what is the number
1 asset of your company?', the first answer was 'DATA!', the second
answer was 'stock value!'.
Wien.
 

"John Kaster (Borland)" writes
Idea is that Borland knows better what users want
from Delphi than themselves. I agree with that. I never
complained about Borland care for Delphi users. All
my complaints are about ignoring wishes of misusers.
#4 Our mission is to make a profit. (wrong)
I agree 100% with that. Funny is how me and JK
agree here, and those who defend Borland moves
use this exact argument in JK favour against me and others.
#5 I need more satisfied customers (wrong)
You want missionaries (right)
I am not satisfied customer, but I am missionary
for sure. During years, I chose Delphi as my
development tool in
"Manufacturer of computer related hardware",
"Finance / Banking / Accounting" and
finally twice in "Education" industry, to use
online survey terms. I influenced several
other purchases, but it is getting harder to
promote Borland in each following day.
Surely I won't compromise myself by promoting
D8 over VS.NET. But, with Delphi 7 patch I can say
it still kicking, and proving Delphi 7 as best development
tool in Win32 arena was never hard.
 

suppliers know their customers needs very well, this does not mean that all
companies or their representatives know their customers (or a customer's)
needs very well.
On top of that, there are the whole set of information arguments (following
Frederich Hayek in the socialist calculation debate
www.calculemus.org/hayek/social-debate.htm, that lead to modern
information economics) that argue that consumers in their local situation
very well know their local needs and no central planner can effectively plan
and allocate resources to meet their needs. Instead, Hayek argued
(www.econlib.org/library/Essays/hykKnw1.html) that the market
communicates that information through demand - the pricing mechanism of the
market.
So in Borland's context, Borland have an idea of what people's needs and
demands are in large part because they get a direct experience of demand in
the market place, what works (sells products) and what doesn't - they get
feedback from people in the market who do know their needs.
But there is an equal and perhaps stronger argument that only a given
developer knows their particular needs in their particular context and this
demand needs to get communicated back to Borland or a third party supplier
through some kind of demand feedback (or by some third party entrepreneur
tapping into this need and meeting it).
I think both sides to the argument have some validity, but tend to lean
towards the customer knowing their needs better. You can meet some really
clueless salespeople who form no idea of your needs after you spell it out
to them, and try to push stuff that does not interest you at all at you -
the ultimate responsibility to know ones needs is with the customer, not the
salesperson.
Some good sales people might be good and know your needs in some sense as
well or better than you, others are clueless, and it is up to you to decide
whether they are giving you good advice or not and whether they do in fact
offer something that is better than what you thought you needed.
Lauchlan M
 

"Lauchlan M" writes
My point here was that beside more comfortable environment,
and few fancy but trivial (overloaded proc, default params),
and one vital (interfaces) language enhancements, Delphi
did not improve much as a pure compiler over years.
It is all contained in misusers word at the end.
 

original article's was.
Lauchlan M
 

On 15 Feb 2004 13:05:08 -0800, John Kaster (Borland) <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>
writes:
absolute myth.
The truth usually lies somewhere in the middle, being a synthesis of the
two extreems.
Take, for instance, "Myth #1". That really depends on who your customers
are. We here are not stupid flower buyers (software designers) who know
little or nothing about flowers (software tools). Infact all his examples
to counter the "myths" include ingnorant or stupid people, which assumes
customers are always more stupid than employees or company managers. This
I just take offense to. I usually know more than the sales person
concerning what I need, especially regarding a purchase that is relevant
to my livelihood. That is, I have done my research. If I need nails, I
know very well the size of nail I need for the project I am building. I
need no advice from the sales person since I have built many such projects
in my life, nor need I explain in depth my project just so the sales
person can "recommend" a nail size. Also, if that store is pushing 1 inch
nails (or .Net) the sales person may try to sell me that length even if it
is not what I really need or is the best tool for my needs. Finally, I
have lost track of the number of times sales people have informed me wrong
about some product for which I knew better (just yesterday infact, about a
phone I was looking to purchase). The things people say just to make a
sale. If I took their advice I'd be the idiot, since their advice is
most of the time wrong. Oh, the stories I could tell about that....
Kevin
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"Lauchlan M" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
totally ignorant of the real ethos behind the statement "the customer is
always right", interpreting it in a totally literal way. Nobody is ever
suggesting for one moment that the customer is always, literally correct.
As you say, the point is that the customer should be accorded a certain
minimum level of respect rather than being repeatedly put-down with "we know
our business better than you", etc, etc. The example of the roses portrays
the customer as a clueless idiot who does not know what his requirements
really are.
Dave
 

"K. Sallee" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
reference to this page is not an endor{*word*224}t of Rick Phillips views. If
Borland developer relations, marketing, etc, feel the same way about
customers as this, then we are in deep, deep merde. :-((
Dave
 

In article <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>, Captain Jake writes:
you "will" do with a product. I do think that the person buying a car often
has a specific trip (such as their particular daily commute to work) in mind
which 'drives' their purchase.
Likewise the software developer often buys a tool for a specific trip (the
current application they need to develop).
Regards,
Steve Tyrakowski
www.sct-associates.com
 

Lauchlan,
here.
 

In borland.public.delphi.non-technical, Dave Jewell <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>
writes <4030a71d$XXXX@XXXXX.COM>...
these newsgroups that there are many customers of Borland's that are confused
and not informed properly at all. In fact, it is obvious from the Kylix
survey/product debacle that many of Borland's customers are totally clueless
about their own future plans, let alone Borland's. Anyone who thinks that
"The Customer is Always Right", well, I would like to interest them in some fine
land in Florida, and a bridge in Brooklyn because such a belief reflects a
naivete' that borders on the ridiculous.
And I find Kevin Sallee's response to be ridiculous. Near as I can tell,
programmers and software developers are just as clueless and prone to myth as
the rest of humanity. The idea that they are somehow immune to the idiocy of
the masses is narcissistic.
--
***Free Your Mind***
 

explain the popularity of VB(Visual Basic) for example ;-)
 

In borland.public.delphi.non-technical, "K. Sallee" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>
writes <opr3gd5c08ri0is8@localhost>...
I see no reason to assume that programmers or software developers are any
less prone to ignorance or myth than any other group of consumers. Judging
from these newsgroups, and other media in which they express themselves, I
conclude that programmers and software developers are no more intelligent or
wise than people who buy flowers. They seem to like to think otherwise
though, which is one difference I see between software developers and the
average Joe Schmoe that is buying flowers. Self-impressions are the
difference,
not real characteristics.
And by the way, almost every single software developer IS less knowledgeable
about software tools than the guys at Borland. In fact, it would be a rather
damning indictment of Borland if most their customers knew more about
software tools than they did.
--
***Free Your Mind***