Re: Version Control Advice

Jim Cooper

Delphi Developer

Re: Version Control Advice

2006-04-04 02:06:48 PM
delphi109

Quote

You have obviously never tried Powers Ice... <g>
Is it that bad? :-)

Cheers,
Jim Cooper
_____________________________________________
Jim Cooper XXXX@XXXXX.COM
Skype : jim.cooper
Tabdee Ltd www.tabdee.ltd.uk
TurboSync - Connecting Delphi to your Palm
_____________________________________________

TOndrej

Delphi Developer

2006-04-04 03:22:56 PM

Re: Version Control Advice

Jim Cooper writes:

Quote

>It's just a few mouse clicks again. It only needs to be done once.
>That doesn't seem like hassle to me.

It does to me.
OK, so your definition of hassle differs from mine. ;-)

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And it gives you a weird looking explorer view. Why not
get a proper view of the repository in a client?
As you've been told already, you don't have to use TortoiseSVN. There

are other clients with GUI.
Hey, I just answered your question (how many clicks it takes to show
history in TortoiseSVN). it is three clicks. Or even just two, if you
take the "hassle" to change the settings. ;-)
I don't want to argue with you or persuade you to use Subversion. ;-)

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>From my experience so far I'd say it was time well invested.

You've missed my point. Why invest the time at all, when you could have
achieved exactly the same end (with a better UI) in much less time?
Because when I evaluate some new technology I want to make an informed

opinion for myself so I am willing to spend the time required to do so.
I don't regret those two or three days I spent experimenting with
Subversion. In fact, for me personally it was fun and a nice way to
relax from working on other, long-term projects.
Cheers,
TOndrej

Jan Derk

Delphi Developer

2006-04-04 03:43:04 PM

Re: Version Control Advice

Jim Cooper writes:

Quote

How do you get a list of
files that have been checked in that you have not yet downloaded?
Right click the project folder and select "Check for Modifications".

Jan Derk

Jim Cooper

Delphi Developer

2006-04-04 04:58:01 PM

Re: Version Control Advice

Quote

OK, so your definition of hassle differs from mine. ;-)
So it seems.

Quote

As you've been told already, you don't have to use TortoiseSVN.
As I have said several times now, yes I did.

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I don't want to argue with you or persuade you to use Subversion. ;-)
You cannot possibly persuade me to use Subversion voluntarily. Unfortunately

these sorts of choices are usually out of my hands - clients already have these
things installed.

Quote

Because when I evaluate some new technology I want to make an informed
opinion for myself so I am willing to spend the time required to do so.
But why not spend less time achieving the same result?

TOndrej

Delphi Developer

2006-04-04 05:10:04 PM

Re: Version Control Advice

Jim Cooper writes:

Quote

>As you've been told already, you don't have to use TortoiseSVN.

As I have said several times now, yes I did.
Sorry, I must have missed that important point. So you were forced to use a

tool you hated. I feel your pain. ;-)

Quote

>Because when I evaluate some new technology I want to make an
>informed opinion for myself so I am willing to spend the time
>required to do so.

But why not spend less time achieving the same result?
I just tend to enjoy having a good time. :-)

Cheers,
TOndrej

Jim Cooper

Delphi Developer

2006-04-04 05:24:53 PM

Re: Version Control Advice

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So you were forced to use a tool you hated.
Yes. By the looks of things I will be again shortly :(

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I feel your pain. ;-)
:-)

Quote

I just tend to enjoy having a good time. :-)
We have a different view of a good time then. Evaluating VCS systems would not

make it to my list :-)
Cheers,
Jim Cooper
_____________________________________________
Jim Cooper XXXX@XXXXX.COM
Skype : jim.cooper
Tabdee Ltd www.tabdee.ltd.uk
TurboSync - Connecting Delphi to your Palm
_____________________________________________

matthew

Delphi Developer

2006-04-04 06:37:00 PM

Re: Version Control Advice

The SubVersion site has all the links you need, but I tried SmartSVN.
Seems fine as an all-in one UI.
/Matthew Jones/

David Smith

Delphi Developer

2006-04-04 06:58:41 PM

Re: Version Control Advice

Jim Cooper kirjoitti:

Quote

>Right click the project folder and select "Check for Modifications".

Yep. Again, really, really clumsy. Why not just have a nice view of the
repository. As I keep saying, the repository is the important thing
here, not your files/directories
No, it is not. Tell me, why should I need the view to be cluttered with

all the files in the repository? Just that I'd feel that I am in
control? No, that is an administrators view of things, not developers.
I'm developing with the files in my own file system. I have no need to
see what's going on the repository all the time. I just have to trust
that it works alright. And Subversion does.
My machine is my sandbox and that is the most important thing to me. I
can always check what other people have done and maybe update my copy
with some changes of theirs, but my copy is the most important to me
when developing.
David S.

Jim Cooper

Delphi Developer

2006-04-04 07:10:48 PM

Re: Version Control Advice

Quote

No, it is not.
It most definitely is!! The whole point of a VCS is that there is a repository

(some VCSs support more than one, which is not necessarily a good thing, IMO).

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Tell me, why should I need the view to be cluttered with
all the files in the repository?
You don't normally need to look at all the files in the repository at once.

However, you **do** need to see those files that apply to your current
project/project group/etc.

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I'm developing with the files in my own file system.
And storing them in the repository. The final word should be the repository,

most definitely **not** your copies of files.

Quote

I have no need to see what's going on the repository all the time.
All the actions you undertake with something like TortoiseSVN are repository

based. It makes much more sense to therefore perform them from a view of that
repository.

Quote

I just have to trust that it works alright. And Subversion does.
There should not be the slightest question of your VCS failing. If there is you

should run a mile. However, many VCSs that are reliable are unnecessarily
difficult to use. Subversion is one of those.

Quote

My machine is my sandbox and that is the most important thing to me.
If I was your manager I would be having a quiet word, then. That attitude only works

if you are a single developer. It is absolutely essential that you work as a
member of a team otherwise.
Cheers,
Jim Cooper
_____________________________________________
Jim Cooper XXXX@XXXXX.COM
Skype : jim.cooper
Tabdee Ltd www.tabdee.ltd.uk
TurboSync - Connecting Delphi to your Palm
_____________________________________________

rambam

Delphi Developer

2006-04-04 07:14:27 PM

Re: Version Control Advice

Jim Cooper <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes:

Quote

I have explained quite clearly what my problems with Subversion are.
I have read your explanations. They basically amount to the fact that

you do not understand subversion and dislike ONE interface tool.

rambam

Delphi Developer

2006-04-04 07:25:36 PM

Re: Version Control Advice

XXXX@XXXXX.COM (Matthew Jones) writes:

Quote

How is it {*word*99}py? For starters, it is just one of three ways to access the
repository. I have another free standalone management thing I downloaded
too. Thus you can use that if you don't like Tortoise.
There are over 23 ways to access subversion using clients and plugins:

" AnkhSVN - A Subversion addin for Microsoft Visual Studio .NET
ankhsvn.tigris.org/ *
CW Subversion - A VCS plugin for Metrowerks CodeWarrior (Note
that this is not currently Open Source, though it might
eventually become so.)
www.soundgeek.org/software/SubversionPlugin.html *
Eric3 - Python IDE with Subversion integration; written in PyQt,
uses QScintilla editor widget
www.die-offenbachs.de/detlev/eric3.html
eSvn - cross-platform QT-based GUI frontend to Subversion
esvn.umputun.com/ *
JSVN - A Java Subversion Client, including a plugin for IDEA
jsvn.alternatecomputing.com/ *
KDESvn - A Subversion client for KDE
www.alwins-world.de/programs/kdesvn/ *
KSvn - A Subversion client for KDE -- a plugin for Konqueror
apps.intra-links.com/ *
psvn.el - A Subversion interface for emacs
xsteve.nit.at/prg/vc_svn/ *
RapidSVN - A cross-platform GUI front-end for Subversion
rapidsvn.tigris.org/ *
RSVN - Python script which allows multiple repository-side
operations in a single, atomic transaction.
https://opensvn.csie.org/traccgi/rsvn/trac.cgi/wiki *
SCPlugin - A Subversion plugin for the Mac OS X Finder
scplugin.tigris.org/ *
sourcecross.org - Subversion SCC Provider (client plugin for
many Windows IDEs) (Note that this is not an open source
project, because the Microsoft SCC API is protected by a
non-disclosure agreement.) www.sourcecross.org/ *
SmartSVN - A cross-platform GUI client for Subversion (Not open
source. Available in a free and a commercial version.)
www.smartsvn.com/ *
Subclipse - A Subversion Eclipse Plugin
subclipse.tigris.org/ *
Subcommander - A cross-platform Subversion GUI client including
a visual text merge tool. subcommander.tigris.org/ *
Subway - An SCC Provider for Subversion (Note that this is not
an open source project, because the Microsoft SCC API is
protected by a non-disclosure agreement.)
nidaros.homedns.org/subway/ *
Supervision - A Java/Swing based visual client for Subversion,
using the CLI, not native libs supervision.tigris.org/ *
Svn-Up - A Java client GUI for Subversion and a plugin for the
IDEA IDE svnup.tigris.org/ *
SvnX - A Mac OS X Panther GUI client.
www.lachoseinteractive.net/en/community/subversion/svnx/
SVN SCC Proxy - A SCC add-in for SVN (Note that this is not an
Open Source project.) www.pushok.com/soft_svn.php *
TMate - A Subversion tracking, reporting and browsing plugin for
IntelliJ IDEA (This is a commercial closed-source product, but
Open Source or Educational projects may apply for free
licences.) tmatesoft.com *
TortoiseSVN - A Subversion client, implemented as a windows
shell extension tortoisesvn.tigris.org/ *
WLW-SVN - WebLogic Workshop (8.1.3/8.1.4) Extension for
Subversion https://wlw-svn.projects.dev2dev.bea.com/ *
WorkBench - Cross platform software development GUI built on
Subversion written in Python pysvn.tigris.org/ "

Jim Cooper

Delphi Developer

2006-04-04 07:25:55 PM

Re: Version Control Advice

Quote

I have read your explanations.
And clearly do not understand them.

Jim Cooper

Delphi Developer

2006-04-04 07:28:15 PM

Re: Version Control Advice

Quote

There are over 23 ways to access subversion using clients and plugins:
Of which I had a choice of one.

If you'd been paying attention you would have noticed that most of my complaints
specifically mentioned that one.
Cheers,
Jim Cooper
_____________________________________________
Jim Cooper XXXX@XXXXX.COM
Skype : jim.cooper
Tabdee Ltd www.tabdee.ltd.uk
TurboSync - Connecting Delphi to your Palm
_____________________________________________

rambam

Delphi Developer

2006-04-04 07:47:54 PM

Re: Version Control Advice

Jim Cooper <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes:

Quote

>I have read your explanations.

And clearly do not understand them.
<shrug.

No, rather I understand them far too well.
I see them for what they are, an attempt to excuse your failure to understand subversion.

rambam

Delphi Developer

2006-04-04 07:49:31 PM

Re: Version Control Advice

Jim Cooper <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes:

Quote

>There are over 23 ways to access subversion using clients and plugins:

Of which I had a choice of one.

If you'd been paying attention you would have noticed that most of my
complaints specifically mentioned that one.
Jim, your whining is tedious.