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Re: What is the Nature of a Delphi Advocacy Group in 2006?


2006-04-24 09:41:30 PM
delphi253
"Jim Cooper" writes:
Quote

>Hopefully this would change in order to keep the meetings alive *if* the
>numbers should dwindle sufficiently.

The "for profit" part might, if Joanna retired, but the bit about MS
paying Joanna most likely won't :-)

However, my feeling is that when JP goes, the group will fold.
Not too many user groups have staying power but here is a computer club that
has been around for 31 years,
www.acgnj.org/
Amateur Computer Group of New Jersey (ACGNJ) is a computer user group (club)
based in Scotch Plains, NJ. Founded in May of 1975, we are the oldest
computer clubs still in operation.
www.acgnj.org/hist.html
For the early history by the club's founder Sol Libes.
Another famous elder that folded several years ago was the Silicon Valley
HomeBrew Computer Club
news.com.com/Crowd+gathers+for+Homebrew+Computer+Clubs+30th/2100-1042_3-5935261.htm
 
 

Re: What is the Nature of a Delphi Advocacy Group in 2006?

In article <444d2ae7$XXXX@XXXXX.COM>, Jeffc writes:
Quote
I have run the North Suburban Chicago Delphi Meetup Group for the last
year and have noticed that very few people show up. Maybe 2-3 at each
meeting. Most of that has been due in part to me being new at this and
poor management of the group.

However, I have been given some great feedback from members (including
Alessandro) of how to increase the numbers of people showing up.

I went to BCOOLS for awhile, but it got boring quickly with much of the
time taken with idle chatter filled with Microsoft put-down quips and the
usual sarcastic comments about the Inprise fiasco and whatever else was
the target du jour. I am not a big Microsoft fan myself, but such jokes
get tired and boring. Aside from those, a lot of time was spent
discussing and rediscussing organization. There was one really good
meeting when John Kaster came out and did a demonstration. Allesandro
did a presentation and so did Extended Systems, both were pretty
interesting, but ultimately not terribly useful for me. I ended up doing
an adhoc presentation of ACE Reporter when another vendor didn't show up.
I've seen notices for your meetings, but I figured it would be at least
an hour each way from Oak Lawn. Evening time out away from the family
has a certain 'cost', so using it for a Delphi meetup with 3 people on
the other side of the metro area vs a round of golf leaves Delphi at the
low end of the list.
Also, I can personally make time easier during the work day to meet than
after hours. The ideal thing for me would be to schedule the meeting
somewhere with this agenda:
(3 pm - 6pm) tee-off for twilight golf rate
(6 pm - 8pm) light dinner meeting in a reserved room at the course
Or it could be a lunch meeting somewhere from noon till 2:30 with golf
after the meeting for those interested. Especially with a small group,
you can get a fair amount of chitchat on the course.
I'm open to a breakfast meeting too. that is probably the cheapest.
Monthly meetings were kind of hard to keep interesting, so we went to
bi-monthly. An alternative would be to do monthly with alternating lunch
vs. dinner meetings. Some folks might do only lunches, some only dinners
and some might do both.
Steve Tyrakowski
 

Re: What is the Nature of a Delphi Advocacy Group in 2006?

Jim Cooper writes:
Quote
Of course, there has been an advocacy group for some time, part of which
was selected for their dedication to Delphi. But perhaps this is not the
time to talk of TeamB :-)
I see Dennis trying to field a team to sell management/corporate types on
Delphi. TeamB is a developer-oriented group. I have never heard of TeamB
helping make a Delphi sale (not saying it hasn't happened, just that it's
not the focus).
--
-Brion
There's no such thing as 'one, true way;'
- Mercedes Lackey
 

Re: What is the Nature of a Delphi Advocacy Group in 2006?

Quote
I see Dennis trying to field a team to sell management/corporate types
on Delphi.
It was a joke, hence the smiley face :-)
Cheers,
Jim Cooper
_____________________________________________
Jim Cooper XXXX@XXXXX.COM
Skype : jim.cooper
Tabdee Ltd www.tabdee.ltd.uk
TurboSync - Connecting Delphi to your Palm
_____________________________________________
 

Re: What is the Nature of a Delphi Advocacy Group in 2006?

jeffc writes:
Quote
I think these countries put more emphasis on the social
aspects of lives rather than the impersonal ones.
I disagree. I lived/worked in the UK for 5 years (loved it) and would
offer a different reason - USA work hours are longer than Euro on
average (USA=less holdiday time, more>40 hour weeks), so time off tends
more towards non-work related socializing and family. In my case,
hiking club, church and just trying to see busy friends once a month
consumes all my free time. If I worked less than 50 hours a week, I
would gladly add driving the 90 min each way to the nearest Delphi Users
Group.
JoeH
 

Re: What is the Nature of a Delphi Advocacy Group in 2006?

I have run the North Suburban Chicago Delphi Meetup Group for the last
year and have noticed that very few people show up. Maybe 2-3 at each
meeting. Most of that has been due in part to me being new at this and
poor management of the group.
However, I have been given some great feedback from members (including
Alessandro) of how to increase the numbers of people showing up. They
include having food, prepared presentations and reviews, guest speakers,
sponsored giveaways, office/conference room usage, advertising in
delphi.non-tech every time we have a meeting, maybe a social get together
like a barbeque event.
One of the things that makes sense to me is to combine an old Delphi group
that has not meet in a over 1.5 years (BCOOLS) and then share the
responsibility of managing this group. The above suggestions obviously
take much time to implement and I think that if a group is managed well
that people will begin to attend. Also merging 2 groups would increase
the numbers. I plan to meet with the old BCOOLs organizer in the coming
weeks.
In all honesty, after reading thru this post I am a bit discouraged.
However, because I believe that exciting things may happen with the new
DevCo and Delphi, I want to keep this group alive. And because my own
personal projects are Delphi based and its what intrests me know.
Once I started posting in delphi.non-tech I did notice an increase in
people signing up. It is hard finding a day to meet that will work for
everyone.
Meetup.com does make it much easier to manage user groups and I have been
fronting the $9 a month fees now for a year. The one thing I don't
undertstand is the low participation in the message boards on meetup.com.
I even email members frequently with new posts and ask them to
contribute, but noone ever does.
Here is what I am looking for in a user group:
- ability to network with others
- learning from presentations and user reviews of products
- winning some free licenses to products
- meeting people with intrests similar to mine
- talking about the new DevCo and what may be ahead
- social aspects
Its a shame that in todays environment that people do everything socially
via the internet. Face to Face has alot more benefits than the internet.
Say someone trying to learn Delphi shows up to a meeting and is having a
hard time getting his first project running. They can bring a laptop to a
meeting and have someone maybe assist them prior to or after the meeting.
Again, there are those that will argue that this could be solved via the
internet as well. But I disagree. Say the person helping this new Delphi
user notices he does not use some of the most time saving features of the
IDE, he might then offer some tips that generally would not have gotten
thru a newsgroup reply.
Its my opinion that even in todays internet based age that user groups
still serve a very useful role. I notice that non-US based user groups
are very successful. I think it is just a difference in views and
environment. I think these countries put more emphasis on the social
aspects of lives rather than the impersonal ones. I have aquintences in
the UK that don't even need a formal user group to get out to the pub once
a week to just chat up technology or politics. I think people in the US
are becoming more unsociable and getting caught up in our fast paced
environments and don't take the time to get out and talk with others. Try
chatting up with someone on the train or while waiting in a supermarket
line and see how uncomfortable they are at first. When I was growing up
it was common to see {*word*62}s interact in this way. Not in todays world, or
at least where I live today.
--- posted by geoForum on delphi.newswhat.com
 

Re: What is the Nature of a Delphi Advocacy Group in 2006?

Quote
And how about Columbus. What is the attendance like there? Any idea?
I was one of five there last Wednesday.
--
Regards,
Paul Breneman
www.BrenemanLabs.com/TransPort.htm - TransPort Support
www.TurboControl.com/TPSupport.htm - TurboPower support links
 

Re: What is the Nature of a Delphi Advocacy Group in 2006?

Quote
I've seen notices for your meetings, but I figured it would be at least
an hour each way from Oak Lawn. Evening time out away from the family
has a certain 'cost', so using it for a Delphi meetup with 3 people on
the other side of the metro area vs a round of golf leaves Delphi at the
low end of the list.

Also, I can personally make time easier during the work day to meet than
after hours. The ideal thing for me would be to schedule the meeting
somewhere with this agenda:

Steve, thanks for the suggestions. They all sound good. Why don't you
sign up as a member and fill in a profile with a brief description about
yourself. I'd like to contact you via the groups email and ping your
brain for some more ideas if you don't mind.
Here is the link to our groups site:
North Suburban Chicago Delphi Meetup Group
delphi.meetup.com/78/
I like the idea of doing the meetings during the day and maybe bimonthly.
I am going to email the members of the group to see how this suggestion
works for them. Its not perfect for me, since I work downtown, but I am
flexible enough.
I am also thinking of starting a message board post and have everyone list
what City/location they live and work. This way if I have an equal split
in the group maybe I will work alternating locations into the meetings.
So that some of us don't have to have the long commute every meeting.
I have contacted Borland 3 times to get my group added to the user
listings on their site with no luck. I think, John Kaster was the last to
followup on my request.
--- posted by geoForum on delphi.newswhat.com
 

Re: What is the Nature of a Delphi Advocacy Group in 2006?

jeffc writes:
Quote
I have contacted Borland 3 times to get my group added to the user
listings on their site with no luck. I think, John Kaster was the
last to followup on my request.
Hah! I remember those days!
I think Serge D. finally got somewhere, but then he moved out of state.
Just when I finally got someone else to take over running the group...
--
-Brion
There's no such thing as 'one, true way;'
- Mercedes Lackey
 

Re: What is the Nature of a Delphi Advocacy Group in 2006?

Paul Breneman writes:
Quote
>And how about Columbus. What is the attendance like there? Any idea?

I was one of five there last Wednesday.

And last night at the Central Ohio .NET Developers Group meeting (at
Microsoft's Columbus office) there were about 25 attendees.
www.condg.org
--
Regards,
Paul Breneman
www.BrenemanLabs.com/TransPort.htm - TransPort Support
www.TurboControl.com/TPSupport.htm - TurboPower support links
 

Re: What is the Nature of a Delphi Advocacy Group in 2006?

Quote
Paul Breneman writes:
>>And how about Columbus. What is the attendance like there? Any idea?
>
>I was one of five there last Wednesday.
And last night at the Central Ohio .NET Developers Group meeting (at
Microsoft's Columbus office) there were about 25 attendees.
www.condg.org
Yep, similar to what we're experiencing -- four of us at our last meeting,
then about 35 at the .NET Users meeting the next night. I wish I knew
how to duplicate their success. Then again, MS pumps a lot of money into
those groups, and they have major speakers and expensive door prizes at
each meeting, not to mention free pizza. Plus most of the attendees think
that VS is the only way to go.
Rick Carter
XXXX@XXXXX.COM
Chair, Delphi/Paradox SIG, Cincinnati PC Users Group
--- posted by geoForum on delphi.newswhat.com
 

Re: What is the Nature of a Delphi Advocacy Group in 2006?

"Rick Carter" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
Quote
>Paul Breneman writes:
>>>And how about Columbus. What is the attendance like there? Any idea?
>>
>>I was one of five there last Wednesday.

>And last night at the Central Ohio .NET Developers Group meeting (at
>Microsoft's Columbus office) there were about 25 attendees.
>www.condg.org

Yep, similar to what we're experiencing -- four of us at our last meeting,
then about 35 at the .NET Users meeting the next night.
The Washington DC .NET group had about 50 people ... and FREE pizza
But they did SELL door prize tickets - helps to pay for the pizza
The last Delphi SIG meeting had about 7 people - and they voted to no longer
call themselves the "Delphi SIG", they want to be called the "Programmers
SIG" since most of the topics are no longer related to Delphi ... maybe
that's why people interested in Delphi quit coming.
Robert
Quote
I wish I knew
how to duplicate their success. Then again, MS pumps a lot of money into
those groups, and they have major speakers and expensive door prizes at
each meeting, not to mention free pizza. Plus most of the attendees think
that VS is the only way to go.

Rick Carter
XXXX@XXXXX.COM
Chair, Delphi/Paradox SIG, Cincinnati PC Users Group

--- posted by geoForum on delphi.newswhat.com
 

Re: What is the Nature of a Delphi Advocacy Group in 2006?

Quote
since most of the topics are no longer related to Delphi ... maybe
that's why people interested in Delphi quit coming.
As someone who has organised speakers for meetings, I have to tell you that it
is very difficult to keep coming up with new Delphi topics that interest more
than a handful of people.
When Delphi was new, there were plenty of topics that would benefit almost
everybody straight away. As people have become more knowledgeable about the
product, those topics get fewer and fewer, to the point now where such things
are purely related to new product features.
The more specialised a topic gets, the fewer people who are interested. Given
that typically a user group only has the sessions available that people are
willing to give, and you find yourself in a very difficult position.
There are non-Delphi subjects that professional developers should be interested
in, but there are many people out there who are only interested in something if
is has Delphi in the title somewhere.
Cheers,
Jim Cooper
_____________________________________________
Jim Cooper XXXX@XXXXX.COM
Skype : jim.cooper
Tabdee Ltd www.tabdee.ltd.uk
TurboSync - Connecting Delphi to your Palm
_____________________________________________
 

Re: What is the Nature of a Delphi Advocacy Group in 2006?

An excellent review of our situation, unfortunately. The group loves
using OP, whether in Delphi or some other product. So we will be
staying true to that theme. We also have a couple of techno programming
geeks that have volunteered to do presentation on general programming
theory, again not specific to Delphi, but interesting to any Delphi
programmer. So please take these accusations that we will no longer be
doing Delphi as the lies they are. We aren't dumping Delphi, but
expanding our focus to include other technologies that are related to
what most of us our doing these days, which is both Delphi for W32 and
ASP.Net for web. Even BDS now does C# and ASP.Net with the VCL .Net.
The world has changed and the group decided to change with it. Some
only see the world as Delphi native compiled and nothing else.
I estimate that we can do about 4 Delphi specific presentation per year
until something really dramatic happens with the VCL. Some of the more
advanced subjects, the overall interest is low or we can not find anyone
to give the presentation. For instance, lots of people are interested
in ECO, but we can not find anyone to give the presentation. And new IDE
features are covered very nicely by John Kaster with his yearly visits.
As someone else pointed out it is often the loudest complainers the are
the people that have traditionally supported the group the least. In
this case one has done their fair share of support, where the other has
done almost nothing.
For every complaint, I get several email in support of the move, usually
by others that have a clue (people that have run user groups themselves).
Thanks for your thoughts.
Jim Cooper writes:
Quote

>since most of the topics are no longer related to Delphi ... maybe
>that's why people interested in Delphi quit coming.

As someone who has organised speakers for meetings, I have to tell you
that it is very difficult to keep coming up with new Delphi topics that
interest more than a handful of people.

When Delphi was new, there were plenty of topics that would benefit
almost everybody straight away. As people have become more knowledgeable
about the product, those topics get fewer and fewer, to the point now
where such things are purely related to new product features.

The more specialised a topic gets, the fewer people who are interested.
Given that typically a user group only has the sessions available that
people are willing to give, and you find yourself in a very difficult
position.

There are non-Delphi subjects that professional developers should be
interested in, but there are many people out there who are only
interested in something if is has Delphi in the title somewhere.

Cheers,
Jim Cooper

_____________________________________________

Jim Cooper XXXX@XXXXX.COM
Skype : jim.cooper
Tabdee Ltd www.tabdee.ltd.uk

TurboSync - Connecting Delphi to your Palm
_____________________________________________
--
Thomas Miller
Chrome Portal Project Manager
Wash DC Programmers SIG Chairperson (formally Delphi)
Delphi Client/Server Certified Developer
BSS Accounting & Distribution Software
BSS Enterprise Accounting FrameWork
www.bss-software.com
www.cpcug.org/user/delphi/index.html
sourceforge.net/projects/chromeportal/
sourceforge.net/projects/uopl/
sourceforge.net/projects/dbexpressplus
 

Re: What is the Nature of a Delphi Advocacy Group in 2006?

"Jim Cooper" <XXXX@XXXXX.COM>writes
Quote

>since most of the topics are no longer related to Delphi ... maybe
>that's why people interested in Delphi quit coming.

As someone who has organised speakers for meetings, I have to tell you
that it
is very difficult to keep coming up with new Delphi topics that interest
more
than a handful of people.

When Delphi was new, there were plenty of topics that would benefit almost
everybody straight away. As people have become more knowledgeable about
the
product, those topics get fewer and fewer, to the point now where such
things
are purely related to new product features.
But isn't that the real problem - if a user group NEVER repeats a basic
topic, how can you ever get new members. If all the topics appeal to only
advanced users, the novices will quit coming. One of the problems we had was
that most of the topics (well many, anyway) required the Enterprise (or what
ever it was called) version of Delphi ... but the members of the group only
had Basic or Professional. As a result, most user group members got nothing
out of the meetings.
The same is true today - most members do not have StarTeam, ECO, and other
advanced (expensive) options ... so why attend meetings where these are
discussed.
On the other hand, I have not used all the VCL components - I am not even
sure what some of them are for.
There are many aspects of component creation that could be addressed. And so
on.
Robert