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Re: What is next for C++ Builder?


2004-06-29 06:31:54 AM
cppbuilder65
Dave Jewell wrote:
Quote
To say that there might be a BCB V9 is rumour and speculation.
To say there will be another BCB is FUD.
I agree with what you are saying, but I'm not sure telling people what
they want to hear (without any proven foundation) can be described as
'Fear Uncertainty or Doubt'. It is equally wrong though.
[I have never claimed there will be a BCB9, even though I'm hoping that
there might be]
Quote
Please don't blame the customers for this continuing debacle!
When did I start blaming people, especially the customers?
I corrected a couple of overly strong statements. Accuse me of
obsession with details and English grammar, but please don't accuse me
of something I have not done.
[At least not without pointing to the reference I should apologise for,
as it would indeed be a bad error]
AlisdairM(TeamB)
 
 

Re:Re: What is next for C++ Builder?

Alisdair,
If they are committed to a BCB v9 release they could just tell us. I don't know what
it means to work on matters. Either they know they are going to do it or they are
uncertain or they do not know.
Is there a planning exercise going on where lower level managers try to prove to
higher level managers that there is a business case for a BCB v9? If so, then those
lower level managers are in the asme position we are in trying to convince the
decision makers to bring BCB back to life and BCB is still dead.
Alisdair Meredith wrote:
Quote
From what I understand, even Borland agree on that, and are working on
correcting matters. I admit that I don't understand why this is taking
so long and am low on patience myself. Howver, I don't work for a
large publically listed company and the concerns that go with that, so
there is a good chance I will never understand the problems that are
holding the info up.

AlisdairM(TeamB)
 

Re:Re: What is next for C++ Builder?

zedd < XXXX@XXXXX.COM >writes:
Quote
>BCB was dead and you have no proof that it is.

Exactly, as long as no corpse has been found, BCB could also
have been abducted by aliens or be living it rich in tax paradise,
for all we know. <g>
BCB is living in sin with Monica in Guantanomo Bay and
will emerge to become a write in candidate for the US
presidency.
 

{smallsort}

Re:Re: What is next for C++ Builder?

Randall Parker < XXXX@XXXXX.COM >writes:
Quote
Is it any less rumor and speculation to say that there might be a BCB
v9 than to say that there will not be?
That is right.
Pretty unethical to spread the rumour that BCB 9 might emerge
when it might be untrue and the rumour could make poor developers
( ie: suckers ) wait around for it to their ultimate disadvantage.
 

Re:Re: What is next for C++ Builder?

"Alisdair Meredith" <alisdair.meredith@ XXXX@XXXXX.COM >writes:
Quote
The surest way to kill BCB is to tell Borland you already believe it is
dead and you are migrating to competing products. Without customers,
they have no incentive to produce a product.
The reality is that they lost all customers for any C like product
( C, C++ or C# ) they might produce when they killed BCB.
 

Re:Re: What is next for C++ Builder?

"Alisdair Meredith" <alisdair.meredith@ XXXX@XXXXX.COM >
wrote
Quote
I agree with what you are saying, but I'm not sure telling people what
they want to hear (without any proven foundation) can be described as
'Fear Uncertainty or Doubt'.
It could be interpreted as such by those who need to come up with the new
product/s. ;-)
Quote
When did I start blaming people, especially the customers?
What you said was:
Quote
The surest way to kill BCB is to tell Borland you already believe
it is dead and you are migrating to competing products. Without
customers, they have no incentive to produce a product.
Dave
 

Re:Re: What is next for C++ Builder?

"Alisdair Meredith" <alisdair.meredith@ XXXX@XXXXX.COM >writes:
Quote
Right now there is no public statement of what Borland plan for C++,
including whether or not a future revision of BCB is on the cards (even
for Win32) Such a statement is woefully overdue, but any attempt to
say 'Borland have killed BCB' is currently FUD.
Wrong.
The last official action of Borland with regard to BCB was
to officially end-of-life it.
 

Re:Re: What is next for C++ Builder?

"Alisdair Meredith" <alisdair.meredith@ XXXX@XXXXX.COM >writes:
Quote
Howver, I don't work for a
large publically listed company and the concerns that go with that, so
there is a good chance I will never understand the problems that are
holding the info up.
Managers with the brainpower of lobotomised aardvarks ?
 

Re:Re: What is next for C++ Builder?

"Gillmer J. Derge [TeamB]" < XXXX@XXXXX.COM >writes:
Quote
You're right about all that which is why I didn't try to refute it,
but that means it has been handled poorly (which is sad, but no
surprise) not that it's dead.
Borland officially end-of-lifed BCB.
Are you accusing Borland of lying ?
According to Borland BCB is dead.
 

Re:Re: What is next for C++ Builder?

"I R T" < XXXX@XXXXX.COM >wrote
Quote
Managers with the brainpower of lobotomised aardvarks ?
You're making a very unkind comparison with lobotomised aardvarks the world
over. If I were a lobotomised aardvark, I'd sue. ;-)
Dave
 

Re:Re: What is next for C++ Builder?

After much cogitation, alisdair.meredith@no-spam-splease says...
Quote

>Please don't blame the customers for this continuing debacle!

When did I start blaming people, especially the customers?
I corrected a couple of overly strong statements. Accuse me of
obsession with details and English grammar, but please don't accuse me
of something I have not done.
[At least not without pointing to the reference I should apologise for,
as it would indeed be a bad error]


I believe he is referring to:
Quote
The surest way to kill BCB is to tell Borland you already believe it is
dead and you are migrating to competing products. Without customers,
they have no incentive to produce a product.
IOW, it SOUNDS like you are saying that customers telling Borland they
are moving to other products is the reason there are no products, rather
than Borland's unbelievable incompetence in the handling of a product.
I know you weren't intending to blame the customers, but after all of
the other apologists that have been here, it starts to sound that way.
 

Re:Re: What is next for C++ Builder?

I R T wrote:
Quote
Borland officially end-of-lifed BCB.
Are you accusing Borland of lying ?

According to Borland BCB is dead.
We're not talking about BCB here. I'm surprised you don't realize that,
since it was your own comment that spawned this branch of the
discussion. Let's recap.
I R T wrote:
Quote
The killing of CBX is true.
Andrue Cope [TeamB] wrote:
Quote
No it isn't.
Duane Hebert wrote:
Quote
there are no new releases scheduled.
See where this is headed, or do I need to continue?
--
Gillmer J. Derge [TeamB]
 

Re:Re: What is next for C++ Builder?

"I R T" < XXXX@XXXXX.COM >wrote in message news: XXXX@XXXXX.COM ...
Quote
"Gillmer J. Derge [TeamB]" < XXXX@XXXXX.COM >writes:

>You're right about all that which is why I didn't try to refute it,
>but that means it has been handled poorly (which is sad, but no
>surprise) not that it's dead.

Borland officially end-of-lifed BCB.
Are you accusing Borland of lying ?

According to Borland BCB is dead.
Gilmer is referring to a comment that I made about
CBX being effectively dead. He's not denying that
BCB was end-of-lifed. I'm sure he knows that as well
as we do.
 

Re:Re: What is next for C++ Builder?

Duane Hebert wrote:
Quote
Gilmer is referring to a comment that I made about
CBX being effectively dead. He's not denying that
BCB was end-of-lifed. I'm sure he knows that as well
as we do.
Thanks, though I'm going to hedge just the {*word*249}siest bit on this. :-)
Clearly the second open letter announced the end of BCB as we know it.
The exact quote was, "Borland intends to continue all future C++ product
offerings with the new C++BuilderX IDE." So you're right, I don't deny
that BCB was end of lifed.
On the other hand, I think there is some question as to whether it might
be getting resurrected. At the very least we have hints from Robert E.
and Anders Ohlsson and maybe from Danny Thorpe too (though my
recollection is that Danny's comments didn't really address this
specific question). So although there are plenty of reasons to be
skeptical, I think there are also reasons to be optimistic.
Only time will tell. Hopefully it won't be too much more time.
--
Gillmer J. Derge [TeamB]
 

Re:Re: What is next for C++ Builder?

Quote
Only time will tell. Hopefully it won't be too much more time.
I wouldn't hope too much. We have been waiting 9 months or so, so what will
another 3, 6, or 9 months matter?
G.