How do I hate Builder?  Let me count the ways.

I hate that it forces me to use VCL.
I hate that it automatically updates the include path to something it
doesn't like.
I hate that it insists on adding a folder to the include path I do not need
there.
I hate that it won't tell me what file it was compiling when it finds a
problem in a header file.
I hate that it won't let me name my dll 85AGA3NX19.
I hate that it reserves the .cpp file of the same name as the program for
itself.
I hate that it forces me to use .h files instead of .hpp files.
I hate that I cannot group related files together and set a local definition
and include path.

news:94kc9g$fcr9@bornews.inprise.com...

Who's forcing you to use the C++ Builder IDE?  You should be able to use the
command-line tools to do everything you want.  There are also a number of
other Win32 development tools, each with their own advantages &
disdvantages.

Use VC++.

Larry.

As bad as Builder is, VC++ is worse!

Greg

You don't have to use VCL. You can use MFC, OWL or even "bare metal" it
with straight Win32 code. Have a day out there.

It does want to do that, doesn't it? I just keep removing them.

You just have to watch the compilation progress window. Compiler error
messages have never told this info.

Why not?

You can use .hpp files.

+=====================================================+
| Jonathan Arnold (mailto:jdarn...@buddydog.org)      |
|         Comprehensive C++Builder link site:         |
| http://www.buddydog.org/C++Builder/c++builder.html  |
+=====================================================+

news:3A6DF232.B9CCC67C@buddydog.org...

Sounds good but how?

That proved futile.  It seems to work ok if I move them to the bottom.

That takes quicker eyes than mine.  The best I could do is compare the .obj
files produced with the list of files in the project.  I've been using
Borland compilers since 2.0 and it has always been clear what file was being
compiled.  In 5.1 & 5.2, the message window displayed the name of the file
compiled along with error messages for it.  Double click on it and it would
actually bring up the .cpp file in an editor window.

beats me.  You try create a dll with that name.  Perhaps its a VCL problem.
I suspect that Builder is managing the dll by using a variable name and the
variable name is the same as the dll file name.  So the dll file name must
be a legal C variable name.  If you can get it to work, I would love to know
how.

Some generated header files use .h extensions.  You cannot change that.  I
prefer to use .hpp for C++ header files because it makes it clear that they
are C++ headers and not C headers.  Also, I frequently work with the files
with tools where it is much easier to use *.?pp to pull in all source files.

Greg Brewer

I disagree.  I have used it since the first version and still do.  It's just
not as "visual" as it's competition.  Sure is less buggy.

Larry.

New....,
then use the MFC Wizard, OWL Wizard, or the Console wizard respectively.

Just do a remake and then the only file it tries to compile will be the
broken one.

Why, it's an illegal identifier. Weird.

But why can't you then rename them?

+====================================================+
| Jonathan Arnold (mailto:jdarn...@buddydog.org)     |
| Havas Interactive             HyperStudio Engineer |
| http://www.buddydog.org http://www.hyperstudio.com |
+====================================================+

A committee is a cul-de-sac down which ideas are lured
and then quietly {*word*241}d. - Barnett{*word*19}s

news:3A6DFEAD.67EA7699@buddydog.org...

Doesn't Console wizard create a console application?  I'm creating a .DLL
that has no use for MFC, OWL, or VCL!

I did.  It goes to "Done: There are errors" quicker than I can read the name
of the file.

I have not been able to find anywhere in Builder where you can rename.  And
if I rename it with explorer, I get an error from Builder that it can't find
the file.

Greg

.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.

Greg,

Try creating a project with a space in it.  Builder won't let you do that as
well.  My guess is there isn't some internal variable but the name is
checked for validity using the same routine that checks variable names
(incorrectly and unnecessarily).

files.

When you program in any environment or API you should use the imposed
standards.  HPP in Builder means Delphi converted header file.  In any case
though, Builder forces the unit files (Forms, DataModules, etc) to have a
header with a H extension and will *not* accept HPP as the header file for
the module.  You are correct here.

Why hate this?  It might be nice if Builder would let you tell it the main
source file to use but in my view that's just adding one more thing to go
wrong.  Just let Builder do its thing and use different filenames for your
source.  It actually makes more sense that way anyhow.  My naming scheme
goes something like this:
    Project:    NewTest
    Main form:    ntMain
    Sub form:    ntSubForm
I find I never have a reason to use the project name for a new source file.
Unless I'm making a one module console or DLL project ... but then, with
BCB5, you have the ability to use the project filename in those instances.

My overview of your message is that you are upset that you can't use the
standards you've created for yourself before using Builder.  That's not a
reason to *hate* it though.  I looked at things the same way as you when I
first came to Builder (3 years ago).  Once I stopped fighting it my life
became a lot easier and I was able to get much more out of Builder.

- Clayton

Greg,

Try "New | DLL Wizard" and uncheck "Use VCL".

- Clayton

On Tue, 23 Jan 2001 16:05:54 -0500, Jonathan Arnold

Under Project/Options/Compiler/Compiling, check the box labeled
"Extended error information" and recompile. This feature was added
with C++Builder 5, but is off by default, though I can't imagine why.
Error messages will tell you a lot more information regarding the
state of the compiler when this setting is on.

Vincent Drake
Borland Technical Support

Yeah, right! (Sarcasm!)

Michael

It creates a non-vcl, pretty straight, application, that you can do with
as you please.

Well, you'll also have to go into the source file that includes them and
change the file it includes, but then you're all set.

+====================================================+
| Jonathan Arnold (mailto:jdarn...@buddydog.org)     |
| Havas Interactive             HyperStudio Engineer |
| http://www.buddydog.org http://www.hyperstudio.com |
+====================================================+

A committee is a cul-de-sac down which ideas are lured
and then quietly {*word*241}d. - Barnett{*word*19}s

I'm not going to argue facts with you, especially with a reply like yours.
Go to microsoft.public.vc.ide_general and compare it to this newsgroup.  The
groups will speak for themselves.

Anybody that is not being sentimental (which makes no sense as it is just a
damn tool) over which compiler they use will agree.  VC++ IS less buggy, and
it also has four service packs that did it.  BCB has one and needs at least
one more.  One more that would fix some IDE issues would be nice since the
first one did not.

Larry.