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Re: Blah Blah


2006-02-23 09:51:46 AM
kylix2
theo wrote:
Quote
Oh yes, and i forgot this one:

What does the word "Cross-Platform" imply for you?
Borland is using it currently very inflationary.

Anyting that runs on mobile devices, Win32 and .Net is "Cross Platform"
...as long as it's MS Windows.

For me, Cross-Platform is what Java does. Multi Vendor OS.

What do you think?
Well MS says that NET is cross platform.
Compared to real XPlatform (Perl, Python, Java), NET is a joke!
 
 

Re:Re: Blah Blah

Hi, I'd like to open a discussion here (on Borland's multi platform
forum) about two subjects:
This is freely and about subjects that don't necessarily belong to this
place.
First question:
I've been playing a little with C++ lately. Even trying to get BCB part
of Kylix on SuSE 10 to work.
Question: What's Kylix BCB and C++ in general good for?
I've never used bcb part of Kylix for anything yet. I've always compiled
the linux stuff with the GNU tools,
and CLX/VCL stuff with Kylix/Delphi
I've Installed Devcpp (mingw) on Windows because I had to port some GNU
tools.
This is a fine thing. (Just sad the code insight doesn't work), for
getting started on GNU-Windows.
But I didn't understand what's the advantage over Delphi for the C++ part.
Just because it's more complicated? No good reason.
And here comes also Dotnet into play. What's this good for? Just because
it's slower? No good reason.
Don't take me as a complete ignorant. I'm not talking about the value of
plain C and I've already written an application
in Monodevelop (with the Gnome/Glade GUI).
I just don't understand why I should do this???
Writing normal apps with C++ is a pita compared with Delphi/Kylix.
Writing apps with mono has no reason yet until Winforms work perfectly.
(which will never be imho)
Java is ok but no fun.
I'd like to see your opinion on this.
Second question:
I have long thought about multiplatform GUI.
First conclusion: This is always a lost war.
Second thought: Make a Object-Pascal-GUI for many platforms. Too many
failed attempts.
Third thought: Create a toolkit in Object-Pascal which starts with
TCustomControl.
Why start at zero? CLX and LCL Gtk, Gtk2, Gnome, Win32... provide a
TCustomControl.
Why not add some unified widgets upon this? If you feel you need a plain
X11 interface, you can still do this later.
These, combined with Interface dependant themes from the start could be
nice.
It's a lot of work, but it makes sense. Instead of wasting monhts for
wrapping Qt or sluggish GTK2, we could make some real thing.
Don't forget that many of the more compilated things are already
written: SynEdit, VirtualTrees...
Hu?
 

Re:Re: Blah Blah

Oh yes, and i forgot this one:
What does the word "Cross-Platform" imply for you?
Borland is using it currently very inflationary.
Anyting that runs on mobile devices, Win32 and .Net is "Cross Platform"
...as long as it's MS Windows.
For me, Cross-Platform is what Java does. Multi Vendor OS.
What do you think?
 

{smallsort}

Re:Re: Blah Blah

Quote
It's a lot of work, but it makes sense. Instead of wasting monhts for
wrapping Qt or sluggish GTK2, we could make some real thing.
Don't forget that many of the more compilated things are already
written: SynEdit, VirtualTrees...
Theo,
Why even hold up the exploitation of other platforms because of user
interfaces? A lot of bright people are spending years trying to get this to
work on their own, and IMO, it's better spent fleshing out cross-platform
connectivity, db support, compiler optimizations, processor support, etc.
You already have a ui platform with the browser. Check out Tibco GI; you
won't believe how sophisticated it is with just a javascript framework. FPC
is close to usable right now if you move your ui development to the
browser. What would move FPC to the next level is maximum support possible
of the Delphi language down to every last keyword. This would make porting
simple enough that a port of anything in Delphi could at least be
considered.
The only platform gui I think is worth spending any time on is maybe OSX.
At any rate, things may change significantly down the road for the remaining
Delphi assets. As long as there is a Delphi, the cross-platform issue will
have to be addressed, because it's a good market if it's targeted
correctly; solely continuing to chase whatever MSFT does with windows is a
diminishing proposition. If whatever newco will be doesn't see this by now
then I don't put much hope on Delphi's future. Maybe they can scale down,
and make some money with Delphi with a much smaller staff.
James
 

Re:Re: Blah Blah

James K Smith schrieb:
Quote

Why even hold up the exploitation of other platforms because of user
interfaces? A lot of bright people are spending years trying to get this to
work on their own, and IMO,
But none of was written in Delphi (the language). And as Florian
Klaempfl said 2 threads above: "Something written in C++ can't be
clean ;) "
Quote
You already have a ui platform with the browser. Check out Tibco GI; you
won't believe how sophisticated it is with just a javascript framework.
That's probably OK (I don't know it), but certainly not the answer for
any kind of problem. And before using javascript and the browser, I'd
prefer Java.